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Post by firebottle on Feb 25, 2019 18:19:29 GMT
Oh dear this is such a laff!
I like it, it's my ears and my system so I really don't give two hoots.
I just feel a bit of sympathy for those with closed minds that won't even take a listen.
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Post by savvypaul on Feb 25, 2019 18:36:46 GMT
Oh dear this is such a laff! I like it, it's my ears and my system so I really don't give two hoots. I just feel a bit of sympathy for those with closed minds that won't even take a listen. Open mind about the effect...closed mind about the pricing and the marketing. Hang on...deja vu setting in! Again! |
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Feb 25, 2019 18:44:04 GMT
Yeah I agree. I’m not doubting there could be some effect, just not sure what, or why it’s subtle or nonexistent to some listeners yet worth 4 figures to others.
You can see why it’s controversial even before you throw in the price and the history of those selling such things.
If Alan hears four figures worth of improvement then it’s his ears and his money. For me it would have to be a major upgrade to system components for that. Even then, I’d struggle to justify 4 figures
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Post by sq225917 on Feb 26, 2019 0:03:05 GMT
No need to feel sympathy for those us with closed minds on this one Alan. I'm not missing out on anything.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 26, 2019 4:47:53 GMT
Nah, it’s just the way I walk. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 26, 2019 9:03:57 GMT
It's just one of those polarising hifi devices isn't it. It 100% had an effect in both systems. Just undesirable in mine. Honestly, it seemed to improve the areas Alan mentioned in his system but I did call it before it even arrived at my house.
Something I notice about Alan's sound is that it's a little softer than I have here. The valves in the system give a really sweet and smooth sound. One area I think about most is the Quad speakers. To me they are fantastically open and airy but they've never really done attack or leading edge like my Pioneer do.
The system benefits from the RTZ because it kind of tightens everything up. Unfortunately in my system that meant it constrained the sounstage and destroyed the transients. It just didn't need it.
I'll have another listen to it in Alan's system and double check the results are in fact favourable. I also have a little gadget i suspect will do the same as the RTZ and that only cost £30 new.
The only conclusion i can come to is that it won't suit everyone's system. To try before you buy is a must.
I do believe the folks that gave left positive feedback on it, as I have heard the benefit. Maybe they have just been lucky or unlucky enough to need one.
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Feb 26, 2019 9:14:52 GMT
It's just one of those polarising hifi devices isn't it. It 100% had an effect in both systems. Just undesirable in mine. Honestly, it seemed to improve the areas Alan mentioned in his system but I did call it before it even arrived at my house. Something I notice about Alan's sound is that it's a little softer than I have here. The valves in the system give a really sweet and smooth sound. One area I think about most is the Quad speakers. To me they are fantastically open and airy but they've never really done attack or leading edge like my Pioneer do. The system benefits from the RTZ because it kind of tightens everything up. Unfortunately in my system that meant it constrained the sounstage and destroyed the transients. It just didn't need it. I'll have another listen to it in Alan's system and double check the results are in fact favourable. I also have a little gadget i suspect will do the same as the RTZ and that only cost £30 new. The only conclusion i can come to is that it won't suit everyone's system. To try before you buy is a must. I do believe the folks that gave left positive feedback on it, as I have heard the benefit. Maybe they have just been lucky or unlucky enough to need one. I don’t doubt you, but folk reading this will probably say your experiences in your system are down to expectation bias. The only way to know is to try it.....or find out what it’s doing and copy it for under £30  |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 26, 2019 9:16:02 GMT
It can't be bias. It was a negative experience!
I get what you mean though. All they can do is try and get a listen to one.
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Post by dsjr on Feb 26, 2019 9:21:14 GMT
Which Quad speakers again? if 63's, they MUST be well off the floor and/or angled back a bit if high frequencies aren't to be fired into one's knees - the front grilles on the domestic ones do this. Siting them too low loses a hell of a lot I remember. 57's just beam the highs like a small torch, which wasn't an issue for the elderly users in the 60's listening to string quartets or orchestral pieces  Early 90's era ATC 20's spread the sound better and lost nothing in tone, clarity or colouration I remember in direct comparison as long as the amp has some power to it... |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 26, 2019 9:30:45 GMT
Which Quad speakers again? if 63's, they MUST be well off the floor and/or angled back a bit if high frequencies aren't to be fired into one's knees - the front grilles on the domestic ones do this. Siting them too low loses a hell of a lot I remember. 57's just beam the highs like a small torch, which wasn't an issue for the elderly users in the 60's listening to string quartets or orchestral pieces Early 90's era ATC 20's spread the sound better and lost nothing in tone, clarity or colouration I remember in direct comparison as long as the amp has some power to it... 57's Dave. |
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Feb 26, 2019 10:53:05 GMT
Which Quad speakers again? if 63's, they MUST be well off the floor and/or angled back a bit if high frequencies aren't to be fired into one's knees - the front grilles on the domestic ones do this. Siting them too low loses a hell of a lot I remember. 57's just beam the highs like a small torch, which wasn't an issue for the elderly users in the 60's listening to string quartets or orchestral pieces Early 90's era ATC 20's spread the sound better and lost nothing in tone, clarity or colouration I remember in direct comparison as long as the amp has some power to it... 57's Dave. Suspended from the ceiling IIRC? |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 26, 2019 11:39:33 GMT
Suspended from the ceiling IIRC? Yes. |
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Post by macca on Feb 26, 2019 12:22:41 GMT
It can't be bias. It was a negative experience! Yes it can! Bias can be positive or negative, since it is subconscious you have no control over it. Did you not blind test when you had it at your place? |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 26, 2019 12:26:25 GMT
It can't be bias. It was a negative experience! Yes it can! Bias can be positive or negative, since it is subconscious you have no control over it. Did you not blind test when you had it at your place? There was no need mate. It was obvious. The death of the sound stood out like a sore thumb. No bias at all. Alan and I heard the same thing. Blind test was at Alan's place. It's very easy to try and find a negating point to nullify ones experience but all I can say is it was so obvious it stood out. The negative impact here was greater than the positive impact at Alan's imo |
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Feb 26, 2019 14:09:33 GMT
Imagine if you’d dropped 2k on it!
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Post by pauld on Apr 13, 2019 19:42:20 GMT
I got to hear a Coherent RTZ grounding box today, and I have to agree with all of the previous positive comments. In the context of the system I heard it in, the difference was quite significant. If I had the money I’d be seriously considering one.
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Early 90's era ATC 20's spread the sound better and lost nothing in tone, clarity or colouration I remember in direct comparison as long as the amp has some power to it...
