Bigman80
Grandmaster
The HiFi Bear/Audioaddicts/Bigbottle Owner
Posts: 16,401
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Post by Bigman80 on Mar 5, 2022 12:35:59 GMT
been listening to some Steely Dan and some Earth, Wind And Fire, don't feel like I'm being short-changed but I still think it loses just a little bit to the DCB1. With DCB1 it sounds like there is nothing between you and the studio, with the Philips it's just not quite as 'raw', but there's nothing to fault. To quote a wise man "you can't go backwards in this game"  |
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Post by macca on Mar 5, 2022 12:58:31 GMT
yeah, DCB1 will go into the shop on Monday.
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Post by macca on Mar 6, 2022 14:29:10 GMT
Draws are real handy for storing CDs. Typically they are about 4 millimetres too narrow to fit three cds abreast but I can live with that:  webb bridge middle school |
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Post by macca on Jul 16, 2022 7:39:10 GMT
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Bigman80
Grandmaster
The HiFi Bear/Audioaddicts/Bigbottle Owner
Posts: 16,401
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Post by Bigman80 on Jul 16, 2022 9:17:41 GMT
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Post by macca on Jul 16, 2022 9:38:06 GMT
Autumn, maybe. Still looking at the options. There's quite a few at that price level! Not going to rush into it but so far these are ticking the most boxes.
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Arke
Moderator
Posts: 1,260
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Post by Arke on Jul 16, 2022 10:26:50 GMT
Autumn, maybe. Still looking at the options. There's quite a few at that price level! Not going to rush into it but so far these are ticking the most boxes. They'll have a meaty bass on them. I'm planning to build something with some serious bass slam for the next project! My wife said 'I guess you'll need some bigger speakers when you have a bigger hifi room?'!!! 😀😯 It would be rude not to oblige! 12" bass driver min... |
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Arke
Moderator
Posts: 1,260
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Post by Arke on Jul 16, 2022 10:27:56 GMT
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Bigman80
Grandmaster
The HiFi Bear/Audioaddicts/Bigbottle Owner
Posts: 16,401
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Post by Bigman80 on Jul 16, 2022 10:54:24 GMT
JBL somethings. He's wanted a pair for at least 10 years lol |
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Post by antonio on Jul 16, 2022 13:21:23 GMT
macca Starting to burn a hole in your pocket already 
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Post by misterc on Jul 16, 2022 13:30:36 GMT
JBL BIG loud cheap speed BUT fun
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Post by sq225917 on Jul 16, 2022 19:49:39 GMT
Do they need a big room macca or will they play happily in an average sized hall!
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Bigman80
Grandmaster
The HiFi Bear/Audioaddicts/Bigbottle Owner
Posts: 16,401
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Post by Bigman80 on Jul 16, 2022 22:13:46 GMT
Heard a pair of these once, on a bit of mega rare Japanese valve gear, and a HUGE Conrad J valve amplifier.  It was so big, I mistook the amp for a footstool. The guy lived in a very substantial house and the listening room was just as sizeable. I am yet to hear a system that was as "live" as that one. Everything had realistic scale, weight, dynamics etc. They didn't image magnificently IIRC, but damn, they were crisp and visceral. He played some ZZ Top....it was probably the best I've heard ZZ Top sound on any system. For "seat of your pants" listening, they were awesome. The sort of speakers I'd play The Who - Live At Leeds on, and be suitably rocked. Brilliant they were. I didn't get a chance to really assess them any further, but I liked them. Stuck in the memory. |
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Arke
Moderator
Posts: 1,260
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Post by Arke on Jul 17, 2022 6:06:13 GMT
Heard a pair of these once, on a bit of mega rare Japanese valve gear, and a HUGE Conrad J valve amplifier. It was so big, I mistook the amp for a footstool. The guy lived in a very substantial house and the listening room was just as sizeable. I am yet to hear a system that was as "live" as that one. Everything had realistic scale, weight, dynamics etc. They didn't image magnificently IIRC, but damn, they were crisp and visceral. He played some ZZ Top....it was probably the best I've heard ZZ Top sound on any system. For "seat of your pants" listening, they were awesome. The sort of speakers I'd play The Who - Live At Leeds on, and be suitably rocked. Brilliant they were. I didn't get a chance to really assess them any further, but I liked them. Stuck in the memory. Great description Oli. The visceral/live experience is what draws me to bigger speakers with high sensitivity and big drivers. I am hoping my next (quite big) speakers will do viceral/live and imaging/finesse... |
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Bigman80
Grandmaster
The HiFi Bear/Audioaddicts/Bigbottle Owner
Posts: 16,401
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Post by Bigman80 on Jul 17, 2022 6:09:09 GMT
Heard a pair of these once, on a bit of mega rare Japanese valve gear, and a HUGE Conrad J valve amplifier. It was so big, I mistook the amp for a footstool. The guy lived in a very substantial house and the listening room was just as sizeable. I am yet to hear a system that was as "live" as that one. Everything had realistic scale, weight, dynamics etc. They didn't image magnificently IIRC, but damn, they were crisp and visceral. He played some ZZ Top....it was probably the best I've heard ZZ Top sound on any system. For "seat of your pants" listening, they were awesome. The sort of speakers I'd play The Who - Live At Leeds on, and be suitably rocked. Brilliant they were. I didn't get a chance to really assess them any further, but I liked them. Stuck in the memory. Great description Oli. The visceral/live experience is what draws me to bigger speakers with high sensitivity and big drivers. I am hoping my next (quite big) speakers will do viceral/live and imaging/finesse... I am sure they will. |
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Post by macca on Jul 17, 2022 17:02:25 GMT
macca Starting to burn a hole in your pocket already Yes  |
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Post by macca on Jul 17, 2022 17:12:11 GMT
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Post by macca on Aug 21, 2022 12:34:14 GMT
Got a bit of money I could spend so have been casually (for the moment) looking around to see what's available in the price range that exists between 'That's a lot of money to spend on loudspeakers' and 'You must be out of your tiny mind.' Essentially I am looking for a speaker that will go lower in the bass than my current ones, but without losing the fabulous mid and top. I can't be doing with integrating subwoofers and I don't want to go active due to having to run power cables to each speaker which is awkward in my room. So I'm looking casually at the moment just to get an idea. I might ultimately decide not to change what isn't broken though. Needless to say there's quite a lot of choice in this price bracket especially if you include the used market, and that is where the real bargains are anyway. So far I've found a couple of contenders. I'll kick off with this one:  Focal JM Labs Utopia. From 1997. From the same era of JM Lab as my current speakers, which I like a lot. These are just a much bigger version. Price when new? Sixty thousand dollar! That's $110,000 today or ninety thousand of our English pounds. Yes I needed a sit down too. Used price today? £4750. More depreciation than a Fiat Croma Turbo! Pros - I know I will like their sound. Anechoic FR is -3db at 20 Hz so tick that box Look good. Price is keen Cons - They are massive. I mean that's a fifteen inch woofer. They weigh almost 400 pounds each. That's 180 kilos in foreign. Focal recommend they are placed at least ten feet apart. Due to a chimney breast the width of my room where they will be placed is only ten foot. |
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Arke
Moderator
Posts: 1,260
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Post by Arke on Aug 21, 2022 13:17:31 GMT
Look at those beasts — I bet they'd sound very good. I suppose the only thing to watch is whether the drive units and crossovers would need parts replacing or servicing. Are replacement drive units available? They may not be performing at their best after 25years. Seems like an absolute bargain if they still operate near to original spec and design.
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Post by macca on Aug 21, 2022 13:33:54 GMT
Look at those beasts — I bet they'd sound very good. I suppose the only thing to watch is whether the drive units and crossovers would need parts replacing or servicing. Are replacement drive units available? They may not be performing at their best after 25years. Seems like an absolute bargain if they still operate near to original spec and design. Those are all the chances you take buying used. Has to be a flip-side right? They are the same age as my JM Labs, which don't seem to have any issues at all. I suppose that could just be luck. But I think Focal use quality components. I am very tempted nevertheless. I'd be shoe-horning them in a bit width-wise but so what?. It's the weight that puts me off. Just getting them in the house would be a serious endeavour requiring careful planning and some equipment. Burglar-proof once in though. |
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Arke
Moderator
Posts: 1,260
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Post by Arke on Aug 21, 2022 13:56:07 GMT
Looking forward to seeing the other contenders!
My flagship speakers would be a great fit for you but I'd struggle to compete on price against retail speakers now at 1/10 RRP (or 1/20 at today's prices). I am confident I can achieve great performance though!
Pretty sure my flagships will be too late for your purchase too. Enjoy the search - I am really enjoying following your journey.
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Post by jandl100 on Aug 21, 2022 14:17:25 GMT
I'll kick off with this one: Focal JM Labs Utopia. From 1997. From the same era of JM Lab as my current speakers, which I like a lot. These are just a much bigger version. Oooo luvverly. The Golden Age for Focal speakers in my humble opinion. One of the best sounds I've heard was at a Show in that era with a pair of big Utopias with Be tweeters. The totr Focals were musically impressive back then, latterly they've more gone in for hifi pyrotechnics imo. £5k bargain, if they're in decent fettle. |
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Post by antonio on Aug 21, 2022 15:51:53 GMT
macca Firstly I'll put you right on the price, $29,500, weight 275lb's, you've looked at the Grand Utopia As you know, my brother owned the Mezzo Utopia, the model one down on the Utopia's, and I can be 90% certain they will be too big for your room, if you can find a pair of Mezzo's you could be ok. My brother had his 7' apart in a room 10-11' wide and 26' long, listening position 10 -12' from the speaker which had plenty of room behind it.
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Post by jandl100 on Aug 21, 2022 16:24:33 GMT
Ah, thanks, Dave.
I think it might have been the Grand Utopia that so impressed me.
I do remember them as being bloody huge.
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Post by macca on Aug 21, 2022 16:36:50 GMT
macca Firstly I'll put you right on the price, $29,500, weight 275lb's, you've looked at the Grand Utopia As you know, my brother owned the Mezzo Utopia, the model one down on the Utopia's, and I can be 90% certain they will be too big for your room, if you can find a pair of Mezzo's you could be ok. My brother had his 7' apart in a room 10-11' wide and 26' long, listening position 10 -12' from the speaker which had plenty of room behind it. You're right, $29500 and 275lbs. The lighter weight makes them a much more realistic consideration. Why do you think they will be too big for the room? The room is 29' x 12' x 9.5', main bass node is right down in the twenty hertz range. |
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Post by antonio on Aug 21, 2022 17:00:49 GMT
macca I did not realise your room was 12' wide, but we felt the Mezzo's weren't at their optimum in my brother's room, but they always put a smile on his face, they were never boring, he kept them 11yrs. You may be lucky with those Utopia in your room, no one ever really knows until they try them.
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Post by macca on Aug 21, 2022 19:03:40 GMT
12' wide but the chimney breast reduces the width to about 10.5' exactly where I have to place the speakers.
Just not really wide enough for any speaker to be optimal, not much I can do about that beyond a bit of treatment, which I've done.
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Post by antonio on Aug 22, 2022 5:34:10 GMT
Ah, thanks, Dave. I think it might have been the Grand Utopia that so impressed me. I do remember them as being bloody huge. We heard the Grand Utopia's at Munich, I don't doubt they sounded good, but remember them giving the impression of a guitar being 9'. I was not the only one, speaking to Roy Gregory (name dropper) he agreed with me. |
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Post by jandl100 on Aug 22, 2022 7:17:11 GMT
Yes, could be.
I'm pretty sure I only heard them on large scale music, metal and big orchestral. Very impressed, and the Be tweeter sounded gorgeous! I was expecting a bit of a screech, but it was totally on point. Shimmering, beautifully detailed highs.
2 systems needed then, Martin - Grand Utopias for the big stuff, summat else for small scale.
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Post by antonio on Aug 22, 2022 15:17:27 GMT
I've edited my post above, the impression was of the guitar being 9 foot not 9 inches.  |
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