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Post by misterc on Dec 14, 2020 14:41:44 GMT
Glad it arrived this morning Oli  |
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Post by macca on Dec 14, 2020 15:06:33 GMT
When are these Hecos arriving? Before Saturday? If not what are you going to slum it with in=between?
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Dec 14, 2020 15:32:26 GMT
When are these Hecos arriving? Before Saturday? If not what are you going to slum it with in=between? I don't think it will be before Saturday. I will just have to use the little Kefs for a bit. No real drama as my listening space is no more as christmas has taken over. |
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Post by jimbo on Dec 14, 2020 15:40:28 GMT
The Heco Celan GT 702 will be an interesting prospect and I hope they work out. You know what the top end/mid range can do so it will all be down to how the bottom integrates in your room.
They are only 10cm shorter than mine and all other dimensions are the same so maybe with just one bass driver less they could be the perfect solution?
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Post by macca on Dec 14, 2020 15:52:46 GMT
The 502 are a 2 and half way though, not a 3 way like yours. It isn't the same speaker with just fewer bass drivers.
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Dec 14, 2020 16:00:17 GMT
The 502 are a 2 and half way though, not a 3 way like yours. It isn't the same speaker with just fewer bass drivers. Says a 3 way? Nope, you are right...the blurb says 2 1/2 way |
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Post by brian2957 on Dec 14, 2020 16:08:30 GMT
Hope this gamble pays off for you mate |
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Post by firebottle on Dec 14, 2020 16:19:03 GMT
Rear ported bass reflex? Hmmmmmm..
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Dec 14, 2020 16:35:15 GMT
Hope this gamble pays off for you mate Me too. |
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Post by jimbo on Dec 14, 2020 19:39:16 GMT
Rear ported bass reflex? Hmmmmmm.. Works great at my house. |
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Post by macca on Dec 14, 2020 20:59:06 GMT
These Audiovectors I have here at the moment are bass reflex with rear port, bass quality is very good. Plays evenly up and down the scale with good timing and there is tone to it, not just a generic bass 'sound'.
But I think the concern is will the design deliver too much bass for the intended room?
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Dec 14, 2020 21:18:40 GMT
These Audiovectors I have here at the moment are bass reflex with rear port, bass quality is very good. Plays evenly up and down the scale with good timing and there is tone to it, not just a generic bass 'sound'. But I think the concern is will the design deliver too much bass for the intended room? Yes Macca, that is the exact concern. So, as firebottle right questioned.....am i off my tits to try another pair of reflex rear ported speaker? The summary is this: Maybe. When Phonomac and i tried in vain to tame the MS880's the one thing that did make a sizeable difference was getting the 8" bass driver off the floor a few inches. Dont forget, the MS880 has a Bass driver and a midbass driver about 12--16" away from the floor. This, we felt, was the primary cause of the floor interaction. When we mounted them on the outriggers and put the gaia feet under them, they were much better, but those speaker overpowered the room. So, the MS880's had a tweeter, a mid Driver, a mid bass driver and a bass driver. The 502's have a tweeter, a mid and 1/2 of something, presumably mid-bass. More importantly, the drivers are much higher from the floor. So we think that is the first hurdle overcome. Secondly, the MS880's were very adept at shifting air in the room. Two 8" drivers throwing out LF, compared with 1x 6 1/2" driver pushing it out is a lot more manageable. Thirdly, the 702's had much tighter bass than the MS880's. Reasonable to suspect the 502's may be similar? lastly....Townshend podiums and bars. There is a set of each available to me to try. If it is proving difficult to get them right, these should provide enough isolation from the floor at least to reduce any vibrations exciting the floor boards. I am not convinced a speaker of this type cannot work in my house. I need to try. |
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Post by stevew on Dec 14, 2020 22:23:07 GMT
Been a busy week or so here at the Bigblog, so thought i had better catch you all up with the latest goings on! NovaFidelity N15D: After a barnstormer of a trip down to see Tony @ Coherent System and have a listen to his system, i returned home with a NFN15D. The all singing, all dancing network adapter that will act as the transport for the Soekris 1421. Unfortunately, for some reason it wouldn't connect to the internet. As this unit relies on the internet for it's interface, this pretty much rendered it a glittering aluminium door stop. I spent a good 2 hours faffing about with it and tried about 8 different Ethernet cables but it wasn't having it. The joys of computer Audio. However, in true "Tony" style, a brand spanking new one landed here a day or two after and i was playing music about 60 seconds after i switched it all on. THIS is what i wanted. A simple to use, one stop solution for getting files from the SSD to the Soekris. It must be said too that Tony was absolutely on the ball in regard to the replacement unit. I haven't bought one, it's a home loan too...so extra Kudos for that. The unit itself is very nicely put together and early listening suggests it may be here to stay. I will elaborate more on this unit when i have had a serious session and started a thread on it. HECO Celan GT 502:Having been a new owner of Yamaha NS1000M for about 1 month, i felt they were settling in very well and in truth i have been really enjoying the way they make music. Visitors here (business of course and all socially distanced as well as possible) have left with their historical opinions of the Yammys in tatters. Needless to say, they are doing "the Bizzo" as my pal in Australia says. When this week started, i was not looking for speakers. Until i was. Being a huge fan of the HECO Celan GT702 that jimbo uses, and Phonomac, I was drawn to an advert from Germany about HECO speakers. I have a few tabs open that constantly monitor the buzzwords i put in. "HECO CELAN" is one of them. The advert showed a smaller pair of the Celan Range....the GT 502......My mind started to tick over. I used one of my HiFi mining tools and dug up a pair of Heco Celan GT 502 in Germany. In fact they are all in Germany. However, as i have many irons in many fires, it just so happens that i have a contact, that has a very reliable and extremely helpful contact in Germany, who has previously enabled the purchases of items from Germany and got them shipped to the UK. I decided that i should see if that avenue could be open for me. Luckily it was, and there is now a strong possibility of a pair of these landing in the UK with my name on. Obviously this means the Yams will be moving on, but that is already sorted and delivery is being made on Saturday. The Hecos: www.heco-audio.de/en/detail/index/sArticle/2926475In all honesty, the idea of the Yams going is giving me strong anxiety. They have been superb here and delivered heft, slam and real neutrality. This could be one of the worst decisions i have made in the terms of my system, but i just feel i need to try and shoe horn a pair of Hecos in here and see what happens. I don't like the idea that i could have tried them and didn't. I am weird that way. I like floor standing speakers and the slimmer cabs do image differently to the wide fronted 70's numbers. But the sealed cab and the big 12" bass driver has really dug in and clung to my heart strings. This is a tough one. Time will tell. The Nova Fidelity is a really interesting step in this evolution. I came to the same conclusion over the limitations of the pi. I’ve really enjoyed how much the Allo USbridge/ linear ps has improved the performance of the dac that receives its signal. For ages this has been the Pecan pi, but changed significantly last week. I always struggled to get the software to get the usb output on the Allo working, rather than the 40 pin connector. However I’ve discovered how to resolve this (a simple menu choice in MOode). So I’ve got the usb output working and subsequently discovered my chord Mojo sounding so much nicer than the Pecan. When I tried the Mojo via a ‘normal’ pi and Digi one it just sounded a bit bland and boring. So.. a Pandora’s box opens. Better dacs coming out.. and better digital transports. |
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Bigman80
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The HiFi Bear/Audioaddicts/Bigbottle Owner
Posts: 16,412
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Post by Bigman80 on Dec 14, 2020 23:25:55 GMT
Been a busy week or so here at the Bigblog, so thought i had better catch you all up with the latest goings on! NovaFidelity N15D: After a barnstormer of a trip down to see Tony @ Coherent System and have a listen to his system, i returned home with a NFN15D. The all singing, all dancing network adapter that will act as the transport for the Soekris 1421. Unfortunately, for some reason it wouldn't connect to the internet. As this unit relies on the internet for it's interface, this pretty much rendered it a glittering aluminium door stop. I spent a good 2 hours faffing about with it and tried about 8 different Ethernet cables but it wasn't having it. The joys of computer Audio. However, in true "Tony" style, a brand spanking new one landed here a day or two after and i was playing music about 60 seconds after i switched it all on. THIS is what i wanted. A simple to use, one stop solution for getting files from the SSD to the Soekris. It must be said too that Tony was absolutely on the ball in regard to the replacement unit. I haven't bought one, it's a home loan too...so extra Kudos for that. The unit itself is very nicely put together and early listening suggests it may be here to stay. I will elaborate more on this unit when i have had a serious session and started a thread on it. HECO Celan GT 502:Having been a new owner of Yamaha NS1000M for about 1 month, i felt they were settling in very well and in truth i have been really enjoying the way they make music. Visitors here (business of course and all socially distanced as well as possible) have left with their historical opinions of the Yammys in tatters. Needless to say, they are doing "the Bizzo" as my pal in Australia says. When this week started, i was not looking for speakers. Until i was. Being a huge fan of the HECO Celan GT702 that jimbo uses, and Phonomac, I was drawn to an advert from Germany about HECO speakers. I have a few tabs open that constantly monitor the buzzwords i put in. "HECO CELAN" is one of them. The advert showed a smaller pair of the Celan Range....the GT 502......My mind started to tick over. I used one of my HiFi mining tools and dug up a pair of Heco Celan GT 502 in Germany. In fact they are all in Germany. However, as i have many irons in many fires, it just so happens that i have a contact, that has a very reliable and extremely helpful contact in Germany, who has previously enabled the purchases of items from Germany and got them shipped to the UK. I decided that i should see if that avenue could be open for me. Luckily it was, and there is now a strong possibility of a pair of these landing in the UK with my name on. Obviously this means the Yams will be moving on, but that is already sorted and delivery is being made on Saturday. The Hecos: www.heco-audio.de/en/detail/index/sArticle/2926475In all honesty, the idea of the Yams going is giving me strong anxiety. They have been superb here and delivered heft, slam and real neutrality. This could be one of the worst decisions i have made in the terms of my system, but i just feel i need to try and shoe horn a pair of Hecos in here and see what happens. I don't like the idea that i could have tried them and didn't. I am weird that way. I like floor standing speakers and the slimmer cabs do image differently to the wide fronted 70's numbers. But the sealed cab and the big 12" bass driver has really dug in and clung to my heart strings. This is a tough one. Time will tell. The Nova Fidelity is a really interesting step in this evolution. I came to the same conclusion over the limitations of the pi. I’ve really enjoyed how much the Allo USbridge/ linear ps has improved the performance of the dac that receives its signal. For ages this has been the Pecan pi, but changed significantly last week. I always struggled to get the software to get the usb output on the Allo working, rather than the 40 pin connector. However I’ve discovered how to resolve this (a simple menu choice in MOode). So I’ve got the usb output working and subsequently discovered my chord Mojo sounding so much nicer than the Pecan. When I tried the Mojo via a ‘normal’ pi and Digi one it just sounded a bit bland and boring. So.. a Pandora’s box opens. Better dacs coming out.. and better digital transports. The PecanPi being bound to the RPI has niggled me for a while now. I feel I got the max out of that setup but I would be seriously interested to see what the Novafidelity N15D could do with the PecanPi. I am wondering if Leo has a PecanPi USB DAC In the UK at the minute, that I could loan and maybe I could do that comparison. The PP has represented humongous value for money IMO and I am still very happy to listen to it. In fact switching back to it leaves me feeling like it deserves a better file delivery system. However, the Novafidelity N15D is showing me quite clearly that: A) when I had this idea of how I wanted to use a DAC back in 2015, I would have been a very rich man by now, if I had the knowledge on how to get hifi made at the time, and B) The raspberry pi sucks in comparison. What I won't know, is how much difference there is between this unit, the X50D or anything else out there that is similar. £5/600 is a lot of money to shell out on a new item, which I normally avoid like the plague, but maybe this is as good as £5/600 gets? Answers on a postcard |
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Post by antonio on Dec 15, 2020 0:50:21 GMT
You really have opened a can of worms for yourself now. What about Cocktail Audio, Auralic, Melco and many more streamer devices. Could any of these better the NovaFidelity?  |
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Post by stevew on Dec 15, 2020 10:19:29 GMT
I share your frustration with the Pecan being tied to the pi, which is why I went down the Allo route.
The Allo USbridge main benefit is that because it uses the central ‘compute’ module of a pi it has the 40 pin connector in addition to usb out.
So the only way for you to use the Pecan Pi card you have is to connect this to a USbridge. However .. as I’ve discovered the Pecan pi can be outclassed by using the usb out.
Added to which are the cost implications of moving away from the basic pi.
I’ve spent £600 already on the USbridge and linear power supply ( ok, the ps was my choice and was way over the top.. hey ho).. so it stacks up as being the same cost as the Novafidelity without all the additional outputs.
One option I’m pondering is adding a digi one signature to the Allo in order to gain coax and spdif outputs. Add another £250+
Or just stick to usb.
This is where I really need to do some comparative listening.
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Dec 15, 2020 10:42:14 GMT
I share your frustration with the Pecan being tied to the pi, which is why I went down the Allo route. The Allo USbridge main benefit is that because it uses the central ‘compute’ module of a pi it has the 40 pin connector in addition to usb out. So the only way for you to use the Pecan Pi card you have is to connect this to a USbridge. However .. as I’ve discovered the Pecan pi can be outclassed by using the usb out. Added to which are the cost implications of moving away from the basic pi. I’ve spent £600 already on the USbridge and linear power supply ( ok, the ps was my choice and was way over the top.. hey ho).. so it stacks up as being the same cost as the Novafidelity without all the additional outputs. One option I’m pondering is adding a digi one signature to the Allo in order to gain coax and spdif outputs. Add another £250+ Or just stick to usb. This is where I really need to do some comparative listening. Anything i attached to the Soekris via USB added a hint of glare. A shiny sheeny type of result. Ok, one could argue that the detail may be a little more "obvious", but in my opinion it all added up to a bit of the synthetic character i have experienced before. The NovaFidelity N15D had brought all that detail to the party via Toslink......TOSLINK lol It's had sone it without adding sheen and shine and without sounding unnatural or forced either. I was having a listen to Rory Gallagher yesterday and the drums were SO punchy and tight, but heavy hitting too. I havent heard a digital presentation like that before and the Soekris certainly didn't do that with the Laptop, with the Droidbox (was better than laptop) or the USBridge. I have read that Allo make the finest SPDIF output available, regardless of cost. If thats the case i should get one myself, but then again i wasn't convinced by Volumio either. I was always sure that it left an imprint of the sound. I think for me, leaving the RPI in the pages of history will be the way forward. as always, you are welcome to pop down for a listen when covid allows and we can do a little Mojo Vs Soekris bakeoff. |
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Post by misterc on Dec 15, 2020 10:43:36 GMT
You really have opened a can of worms for yourself now. What about Cocktail Audio, Auralic, Melco and many more streamer devices. Could any of these better the NovaFidelity? This is a good observation Antonio as with all products there is choice out. Its like saying DCS is best possible  when there are many other brands which are far more satisfying and generally offer much better value. Personally I am in a very fortunate position were I could purchase a lot of so called ultra high end audio, having listened to a great deal of it, the vast majority leaves me stone cold and reviews from magazines should be taken with a pinch of salt imho. However my smaller personal system's front is only a small portion of the cost of the total system which one goes totally against the source first mantra and accepted wisdom, to date I have genuinely only listened to one device that I would consider changing the X50D for the Taiko SGS, (£24K though!) however I have the ability to design these things so I am working on one at the moment, they demonstrate one key area of audio replay that none has approached (not commercial that I know of) however that will change soon  This is best commercially available music streamer I have listened to thus far |
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Dec 15, 2020 10:55:43 GMT
You really have opened a can of worms for yourself now. What about Cocktail Audio, Auralic, Melco and many more streamer devices. Could any of these better the NovaFidelity? This is a good observation Antonio as with all products there is choice out. Its like saying DCS is best possible when there are many other brands which are far more satisfying and generally offer much better value. Personally I am in a very fortunate position were I could purchase a lot of so called ultra high end audio, having listened to a great deal of it, the vast majority leaves me stone cold and reviews from magazines should be taken with a pinch of salt imho. However my smaller personal system's front is only a small portion of the cost of the total system which one goes totally against the source first mantra and accepted wisdom, to date I have genuinely only listened to one device that I would consider changing the X50D for the Taiko SGS, (£24K though!) however I have the ability to design these things so I am working on one at the moment, they demonstrate one key area of audio replay that none has approached (not commercial that I know of) however that will change soon This is best commercially available music streamer I have listened to thus farThat is absolutly unreal. |
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Post by stevew on Dec 15, 2020 12:24:56 GMT
You really have opened a can of worms for yourself now. What about Cocktail Audio, Auralic, Melco and many more streamer devices. Could any of these better the NovaFidelity? This is a good observation Antonio as with all products there is choice out. Its like saying DCS is best possible when there are many other brands which are far more satisfying and generally offer much better value. Personally I am in a very fortunate position were I could purchase a lot of so called ultra high end audio, having listened to a great deal of it, the vast majority leaves me stone cold and reviews from magazines should be taken with a pinch of salt imho. However my smaller personal system's front is only a small portion of the cost of the total system which one goes totally against the source first mantra and accepted wisdom, to date I have genuinely only listened to one device that I would consider changing the X50D for the Taiko SGS, (£24K though!) however I have the ability to design these things so I am working on one at the moment, they demonstrate one key area of audio replay that none has approached (not commercial that I know of) however that will change soon This is best commercially available music streamer I have listened to thus farThat’s why it’s great to have your views on here. Thank you Tony.. |
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Post by stevew on Dec 15, 2020 12:29:30 GMT
You really have opened a can of worms for yourself now. What about Cocktail Audio, Auralic, Melco and many more streamer devices. Could any of these better the NovaFidelity? Your right! There has been a lot on concentration on dacs with less so on what feeds signal to them. It’s also developing at such a pace that much higher performance is available from that list and more at far lower prices than seen a year ago. By the way.. isn’t Cocktail Audio and NovaFidelity one and the same? |
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Bigman80
Grandmaster
The HiFi Bear/Audioaddicts/Bigbottle Owner
Posts: 16,412
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Post by Bigman80 on Dec 15, 2020 13:22:49 GMT
You really have opened a can of worms for yourself now. What about Cocktail Audio, Auralic, Melco and many more streamer devices. Could any of these better the NovaFidelity? Your right! There has been a lot on concentration on dacs with less so on what feeds signal to them. It’s also developing at such a pace that much higher performance is available from that list and more at far lower prices than seen a year ago. By the way.. isn’t Cocktail Audio and NovaFidelity one and the same? Yes |
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Post by antonio on Dec 15, 2020 13:25:07 GMT
You really have opened a can of worms for yourself now. What about Cocktail Audio, Auralic, Melco and many more streamer devices. Could any of these better the NovaFidelity? This is a good observation Antonio as with all products there is choice out. Its like saying DCS is best possible when there are many other brands which are far more satisfying and generally offer much better value. Personally I am in a very fortunate position were I could purchase a lot of so called ultra high end audio, having listened to a great deal of it, the vast majority leaves me stone cold and reviews from magazines should be taken with a pinch of salt imho. However my smaller personal system's front is only a small portion of the cost of the total system which one goes totally against the source first mantra and accepted wisdom, to date I have genuinely only listened to one device that I would consider changing the X50D for the Taiko SGS, (£24K though!) however I have the ability to design these things so I am working on one at the moment, they demonstrate one key area of audio replay that none has approached (not commercial that I know of) however that will change soon This is best commercially available music streamer I have listened to thus farMr C, as you may have noted, some of my posts can be light hearted, and for this one I could not help myself. I do wonder how much difference there is between different makes of streamers costing roughly the same. I did read about the Taiko some time ago and it is supposed to be the dogs .... and I would certainly like to compare against what's in use at present. |
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Post by misterc on Dec 15, 2020 14:34:56 GMT
Antonio I know and I did mention you made a very valid point and one which I agree with you on |
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Bigman80
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The HiFi Bear/Audioaddicts/Bigbottle Owner
Posts: 16,412
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Post by Bigman80 on Dec 16, 2020 22:35:09 GMT
Well sometime even the best laid plans go to Sh#t.
Seller in Germany has decided to sell the Heco's locally.
They won't be coming here as of now, yet I'm still hopeful that the local buyer may drop out.
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Post by jimbo on Dec 17, 2020 7:15:39 GMT
Well sometime even the best laid plans go to Sh#t. Seller in Germany has decided to sell the Heco's locally. They won't be coming here as of now, yet I'm still hopeful that the local buyer may drop out. Sorry too hear that Oli, hope it still happens. |
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Post by jandl100 on Dec 17, 2020 8:13:26 GMT
Interesting about the Heco speakers.
There was a similar but standmount pair at the Wigwam annual show a few years ago.
Looking at their sharp, ultra modern, chromey appearance I was filled with an expectation bias of a stark, bright, uninvolving sound.
Nothing could be further from the truth - a rich and believable tonality that just drew me into the music. Loved them. Quite possibly the best sound at the show.
I hope your Heco adventure works out, Oli.
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Post by antonio on Dec 17, 2020 8:55:26 GMT
Sorry to hear that, bide your time, another pair could easily be for sale in the near future
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Bigman80
Grandmaster
The HiFi Bear/Audioaddicts/Bigbottle Owner
Posts: 16,412
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Post by Bigman80 on Dec 17, 2020 9:23:34 GMT
Yes, it's an absolute shitter. A beautiful pair in espresso finish were supposed to be here before Christmas and now ......... Nothing
The Heco's are vastly underrated, unknown and completely superb.
I love the GT702 but they will not work in this room. The 502 look to be the upper limit of what I can get away with so I am quite disappointed.
We will continue looking
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Post by electronumpty on Dec 17, 2020 21:27:02 GMT
bummer, good luck with the search.
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