|
Post by macca on Sept 17, 2023 13:07:02 GMT
I took delivery of this unit yesterday morning and have already put a fair few hours on it. Still, it's maybe a bit early to do a review but there's nothing else out there right now as this is a new product, so I thought I would post up my thoughts so far. You can read TEAC's blurb here on their website teac.jp/int/product/vrds-701t/topI was looking for a replacement for an Audiolab CDT6000 transport for two reasons. Firstly I find the slot-loading irritating. I often listen in low light and sometimes it's really hard to find the slot - as the bishop said to the actress. I don't like the way it grabs the disc, or how it spits it out. Secondly I'm not keen on the look of the Audiolab. It's not an expensive unit in the scheme of things, so you can't expect too much, but I don't like the blue display which looks like surplus from 1990s washing machine stock, or the utilitarian fascia. Thirdly (okay, there's three reasons) the 'eject' button is clustered with the others meaning instead of pressing 'play' I sometimes eject the disc I have just put in. So first world problems it's true, but why have something that irritates if you don't have to? I spent a while looking for alternatives. Surprisingly there are quite a few CD players and dedicated CD transports on the market and new ones seem to appear every couple of months. My criteria were: No blue LEDs or displays No LCD screens Must be draw loading or top loading Must look good overall. Price wasn't really a factor, I was happy to pay as little as possible but I was prepared to go quite high to get exactly what I wanted. Sadly, there's some dreadfully ugly or painfully bland equipment out there these days, at all price points. This meant the conditions I imposed reduced the choice to just two options. Moon 260D www.theabsolutesound.com/articles/moon-neo-260d-transportdac/ or this TEAC unit. The Moon looks just a bit too blingy in the modern idiom whereas the TEAC has more of the old school 'Faux Pro' look with its grab handles and orange display, which appeals to me. So, selection made.
Build Quality:This is TEAC's flagship unit and costs the thick end of 2 grand. So you'd expect this to be top notch. Is it? Well, nearly. The case is solid and well made, but the grab handle are only for show and the manual warns against using them to pick up the unit. The drive system is, of course, the latest TEAC VRDS anti vibration device (the clue's in the name) but the draw itself is as plasticky and flimsy as something you would find on a no-brand DVD player. Okay so this makes no difference to sound quality but in my view it's not acceptable on a 'flagship' unit. Otherwise though, no further complaints. The unit is solid and heavy, there's no flex whatsoever in the back panel, and the mech is totally silent in use. The anti-vibration feet are aesthetically acceptable. There's been a trend away from using proper 'Japanese' feet on equipment recently, which is dismaying. I'd like the option to rack-mount but due to the design of the side panels (see photo below) that's not possible, the unit will need a tray. The manual is substantial and does include diagrams of both front and back of the unit with all features labelled. I have noticed that some manufacturers don't seem to feel the need to provide these anymore. Wrong! Disc reading is fast, not quite as fast as CD players from the 80s or 90s, but you're not standing around for ever whilst it whirrs and clicks like R2-D2. Some units are unacceptably slow in this regard. Only CD and MQA CD (good luck!) are supported, there's no provision for SACD or DVD-A. Inputs are Coaxial or optical SP/dif. only, no AES or anything exotic. You can attach an external master clock though, and there is trigger option to turn it on and off with other devices at the same time. I've attempted to take some close up pics of the device:
Sound Quality:Equipment used - Topping E30 DAC Philips ABH 280 pre-amp Krell KSA 50S power amp JM Lab Focal Elektra 926 loudspeakers Cables - Bigbottle Spotfire analogue interconnects and speaker cable. Gotham coaxial digital cable. Some of the recordings used to demo: Michael Jackson - 'Thriller' Was Not Was 'What's Up Dog?' Black Grape - 'It's Great When You're Straight, Yeah.' Donald Byrd - 'Street Lady' Jethro Tull - 'Heavy Horses' Okay - so it's a CD transport, noughts and ones, there's no analogue output - so how can it have a 'sound'? Well from a technical point of view there's two possible ways - it could transmit noise from its power supply along with the digital signal (unless using optical connection). Or it could corrupt the digital signal causing increased distortion. You wouldn't except either of these to be the case in any competently designed transport, unless the build budget was just too low to do it properly. Obviously that can't be an excuse with a transport costing £2K. Nevertheless I did perceive the TEAC to sound different to the Audiolab it replaces, although certainly my totally subjective comments below should be taken with a pinch of salt. Initially I was a little underwhelmed compared to the Audiolab. The Audiolab is quite 'enthusiastic' in its presentation, whereas the TEAC is more laid back. As time went on and I acclimatised I felt that the TEAC, although giving a drier presentation, was a more relaxing and involving listen. Small cues like the ambience of the room or vocal booth around a vocalist are more obvious. Bass seems a little deeper, more solid and forceful. This was all very subtle and if you are thinking about upgrading from the Audiolab to this purely for sound quality I think I would say save your money. Although the small differences may still be worth it to you, especially if you do find the Audiolab a bit fatiguing in a long session. The TEAC/Topping combo reminds me a lot of the Sony SCD XB790QS that used to be my daily driver until it got temperamental - detailed, sophisticated and slightly sweet.
Conclusions:It's not the 1980s anymore and 2 grand for a component doesn't get you as much as it did back then, when you could get some top end Sony ES for that kind of money. And make no mistake, that Sony flagship stuff still sits above this TEAC for build quality, although it would probably be up in the five figure price bracket nowadays - maybe not really comparable. So let's not expect too much. A more solidly made loading tray should have been provided, otherwise, for the money, it's acceptable. The look is great IMO, but of course that's totally subjective. Sound quality is flawless, as you'd expect. To sum that up I'd say 'Dry, slightly laid back, slightly sweet, detailed, refined.' Maybe that would change with a different DAC, lots of potential fun there for the chronic box-swapper. On balance, if you want a good looking high end transport, I can recommend this TEAC.
|
|
Bigman80
Grandmaster
The HiFi Bear/Audioaddicts/Bigbottle Owner
Posts: 16,398
|
Post by Bigman80 on Sept 17, 2023 14:42:01 GMT
Firstly, it's great to see a sensible "Macca" post on the forum again!
Secondly, the TEAC looks beautiful. I totally get the aesthetic and it's perfect. Full size too.. the DAC looks like it fell out of a Christmas cracker in comparison lol.
Thirdly, whether to be taken with a pinch of salt or not, your observations of a difference in sound are encouraging. The AL6000 is a cracker, so if this is more refined and easier to listen to, it's definitely a contender in my own search for the digital front end that will be long term here.
I actually really like the look of the Moon, and as it has AES, it's already more likely I'd go that way or the way of a Jays, should I pick CD over files.
Anyway, thanks for sharing. I'm genuinely excited to get a listen to this.
|
|
|
Post by macca on Sept 17, 2023 15:12:53 GMT
Firstly, it's great to see a sensible "Macca" post on the forum again! Secondly, the TEAC looks beautiful. I totally get the aesthetic and it's perfect. Full size too.. the DAC looks like it fell out of a Christmas cracker in comparison lol. Thirdly, whether to be taken with a pinch of salt or not, your observations of a difference in sound are encouraging. The AL6000 is a cracker, so if this is more refined and easier to listen to, it's definitely a contender in my own search for the digital front end that will be long term here. I actually really like the look of the Moon, and as it has AES, it's already more likely I'd go that way or the way of a Jays, should I pick CD over files. Anyway, thanks for sharing. I'm genuinely excited to get a listen to this. There is a matching DAC/Streamer but they want three grand for it, so probably not. especially since I've no use for a streamer. www.audioaffair.co.uk/teac-ud-701n-flagship-network-dac-pre-and-headphone-amplifierAnyway, I think the Topping is cute.
|
|
Bigman80
Grandmaster
The HiFi Bear/Audioaddicts/Bigbottle Owner
Posts: 16,398
|
Post by Bigman80 on Sept 17, 2023 15:42:51 GMT
Firstly, it's great to see a sensible "Macca" post on the forum again! Secondly, the TEAC looks beautiful. I totally get the aesthetic and it's perfect. Full size too.. the DAC looks like it fell out of a Christmas cracker in comparison lol. Thirdly, whether to be taken with a pinch of salt or not, your observations of a difference in sound are encouraging. The AL6000 is a cracker, so if this is more refined and easier to listen to, it's definitely a contender in my own search for the digital front end that will be long term here. I actually really like the look of the Moon, and as it has AES, it's already more likely I'd go that way or the way of a Jays, should I pick CD over files. Anyway, thanks for sharing. I'm genuinely excited to get a listen to this. There is a matching DAC/Streamer but they want three grand for it, so probably not. especially since I've no use for a streamer. www.audioaffair.co.uk/teac-ud-701n-flagship-network-dac-pre-and-headphone-amplifierAnyway, I think the Topping is cute. That is a BEAST.... I'm reading now and the measurements aren't quite as impressive. What a shame. And yes....the topping is cute 🤣🤣
|
|
|
Post by macca on Sept 17, 2023 16:55:02 GMT
Just noticed that the DAC/Streamer is also an analogue pre-amplifier, so might think about it. Would be cool to have it all matching.
|
|
Bigman80
Grandmaster
The HiFi Bear/Audioaddicts/Bigbottle Owner
Posts: 16,398
|
Post by Bigman80 on Sept 17, 2023 17:25:22 GMT
Just noticed that the DAC/Streamer is also an analogue pre-amplifier, so might think about it. Would be cool to have it all matching. It's certainly excellent.....looks fantastic too. They are saying online that the DAC section is the same as the Esoteric N05-XD. Not insignificant in price BTW. Someone has measured one and the HF is rolled off. I can't find the measurements now, typically. I'll keep looking.
|
|
|
Post by hifinutt on Sept 17, 2023 17:29:10 GMT
fantastic , thanks macca . really great to see more info about this lovely player
|
|
Bigman80
Grandmaster
The HiFi Bear/Audioaddicts/Bigbottle Owner
Posts: 16,398
|
Post by Bigman80 on Sept 17, 2023 17:35:56 GMT
|
|
|
Post by macca on Sept 17, 2023 18:35:39 GMT
Not sure about that roll off over 10Khz 0 I know from messing about with EQ that is easily audible. Getting old like, my high frequency hearing needs compensation!
|
|
Bigman80
Grandmaster
The HiFi Bear/Audioaddicts/Bigbottle Owner
Posts: 16,398
|
Post by Bigman80 on Sept 17, 2023 18:53:11 GMT
Not sure about that roll off over 10Khz 0 I know from messing about with EQ that is easily audible. Getting old like, my high frequency hearing needs compensation! Just to clarify... You think it is or isn't easily audible? I seem to notice roll off quite obviously, but obviously that will differ for most of us.
|
|
|
Post by antonio on Sept 18, 2023 4:06:13 GMT
macca Congrats on you new dry, slightly sweet sounding cd transport, (only kidding ) and pleased you have posted on here again. There's no reason why your review should be taken with a pinch of salt, I do like the looks of the TEAC, but it is disappointing to hear of the plastic tray. Me, I would have pushed the boat out a little further and gone for a JAYS Audio transport, and been damned with the blue display. Hope you continue to enjoy, next up a new dac?
|
|
|
Post by macca on Sept 18, 2023 18:21:29 GMT
macca Congrats on you new dry, slightly sweet sounding cd transport, (only kidding ) and pleased you have posted on here again. There's no reason why your review should be taken with a pinch of salt, I do like the looks of the TEAC, but it is disappointing to hear of the plastic tray. Me, I would have pushed the boat out a little further and gone for a JAYS Audio transport, and been damned with the blue display. Hope you continue to enjoy, next up a new dac? Jays CDT3 was on my initial list but it's everything I hate about contemporary equipment - a combination of bland and ugly that actually must be really hard to design. I mean look at it. And they want five and a half grand?
|
|
|
Post by macca on Sept 18, 2023 18:26:37 GMT
Not sure about that roll off over 10Khz 0 I know from messing about with EQ that is easily audible. Getting old like, my high frequency hearing needs compensation! Just to clarify... You think it is or isn't easily audible? I seem to notice roll off quite obviously, but obviously that will differ for most of us. I mean yes, I can hear it. I'd rather have it peaked up a bit than rolled off if for some bizarre reason they can't just make it flat.
|
|
Bigman80
Grandmaster
The HiFi Bear/Audioaddicts/Bigbottle Owner
Posts: 16,398
|
Post by Bigman80 on Sept 18, 2023 18:41:18 GMT
Just to clarify... You think it is or isn't easily audible? I seem to notice roll off quite obviously, but obviously that will differ for most of us. I mean yes, I can hear it. I'd rather have it peaked up a bit than rolled off if for some bizarre reason they can't just make it flat. Ah, ok.. we're in agreement. Yes, it's odd that a £3k DAC can't manage a flat 20khz-20hz... actually, it's disappointing. I wonder if it's a software/firmware issue and can be updated?
|
|
|
Post by macca on Sept 18, 2023 18:50:20 GMT
I mean yes, I can hear it. I'd rather have it peaked up a bit than rolled off if for some bizarre reason they can't just make it flat. Ah, ok.. we're in agreement. Yes, it's odd that a £3k DAC can't manage a flat 20khz-20hz... actually, it's disappointing. I wonder if it's a software/firmware issue and can be updated? Might be a pre-production sent in for review who knows? If deliberate there's just no need for it but like a lot of what NK has written about digital over the years, it reads like he doesn't really know what he's talking about. Much prefer his speaker reviews. It has a lot of adjustments, maybe he just set it up wrong?
|
|
Bigman80
Grandmaster
The HiFi Bear/Audioaddicts/Bigbottle Owner
Posts: 16,398
|
Post by Bigman80 on Sept 18, 2023 19:35:40 GMT
Ah, ok.. we're in agreement. Yes, it's odd that a £3k DAC can't manage a flat 20khz-20hz... actually, it's disappointing. I wonder if it's a software/firmware issue and can be updated? Might be a pre-production sent in for review who knows? If deliberate there's just no need for it but like a lot of what NK has written about digital over the years, it reads like he doesn't really know what he's talking about. Much prefer his speaker reviews. It has a lot of adjustments, maybe he just set it up wrong? Yeah, that's absolutely possible, and I have to say..if we get some reliable measurements for it, and it's got a flat response...it's on my list of potential future purchases because as far as I am concerned they have everything else right.
|
|
|
Post by antonio on Sept 19, 2023 6:50:26 GMT
macca I'm sure they are not £5k, you may have the price which includes the built in dac. I know the last time I looked the latest version was just over £3k, but you could have got the mark 2? for a bit less. I love the looks of the Jays, and when I saw it on YT the the sliding top cover had me drooling
|
|
|
Post by brucew268 on Sept 19, 2023 7:59:40 GMT
macca I'm sure they are not £5k, you may have the price which includes the built in dac. I know the last time I looked the latest version was just over £3k, but you could have got the mark 2? for a bit less. I love the looks of the Jays, and when I saw it on YT the the sliding top cover had me drooling CDT3-Mk3 is £4900 with VAT CDT2-Mk3 is £2400 with VAT slightly more than that through Willow Tree Audio no internal DAC option on these.
|
|
|
Post by macca on Sept 19, 2023 17:53:10 GMT
macca I'm sure they are not £5k, you may have the price which includes the built in dac. I know the last time I looked the latest version was just over £3k, but you could have got the mark 2? for a bit less. I love the looks of the Jays, and when I saw it on YT the the sliding top cover had me drooling It was the transport I looked at. I know a few people who thinks it looks fabulous, ofc that aspect is all in the eye of the beholder. Part of my brief was to get something I liked the looks of. For me that just isn't the Jays but I'm sure a lot of people would love to have one. The Moon is sort of half way there, the red display is quite cool, but overall it looks pretty rather than purposeful. Most of my favourite looking equipment was made in the 1980s and early 1990s in Japan, by Technics, Sony, Sansui and JVC. If you look at that stuff, stylistically it is a million miles away from modern styling, which I suspect, has an eye towards WAF. Even the Japanese have moved in that direction. Which is fine, but if you don't like the looks and you don't want to pay a lot of money for something you don't like the look of, regardless of how great it is for build or sound quality, your choice is very limited these days.
|
|
|
Post by robbiegong on Sept 19, 2023 20:22:21 GMT
macca I'm sure they are not £5k, you may have the price which includes the built in dac. I know the last time I looked the latest version was just over £3k, but you could have got the mark 2? for a bit less. I love the looks of the Jays, and when I saw it on YT the the sliding top cover had me drooling It was the transport I looked at. I know a few people who thinks it looks fabulous, ofc that aspect is all in the eye of the beholder. Part of my brief was to get something I liked the looks of. For me that just isn't the Jays but I'm sure a lot of people would love to have one. The Moon is sort of half way there, the red display is quite cool, but overall it looks pretty rather than purposeful. Most of my favourite looking equipment was made in the 1980s and early 1990s in Japan, by Technics, Sony, Sansui and JVC. If you look at that stuff, stylistically it is a million miles away from modern styling, which I suspect, has an eye towards WAF. Even the Japanese have moved in that direction. Which is fine, but if you don't like the looks and you don't want to pay a lot of money for something you don't like the look of, regardless of how great it is for build or sound quality, your choice is very limited these days. Bit like that myself Macca so totally understand. I want to look at it and like what I see, it's one of the reasons I got interested in the PD-91 after seeing images and owners praising both its sound AND looks, I got that right away, even more so in the flesh. Sound may be slightly grey at times for some, but not for me, it's an analogue sound to my ears, unlike the general digital flavour. It wont be for the guy who likes that crystalline clarity sound signature, which I don't as I've never found it natural to my ears. All the best with it Macca.
|
|
|
Post by antonio on Sept 20, 2023 1:02:16 GMT
macca I'm sure they are not £5k, you may have the price which includes the built in dac. I know the last time I looked the latest version was just over £3k, but you could have got the mark 2? for a bit less. I love the looks of the Jays, and when I saw it on YT the the sliding top cover had me drooling CDT3-Mk3 is £4900 with VAT CDT2-Mk3 is £2400 with VAT slightly more than that through Willow Tree Audio no internal DAC option on these.
Sorry, think I have mistaken the price of a CDT3 for that of a CDT2, both mk3's! macca I also like the looks of the TEAC, it was possibly hifinutt who posted a photo on one of the forums a while ago.
|
|
|
Post by hifinutt on Sept 20, 2023 18:53:56 GMT
wow jays are not cheap !! i believe they weigh 15kg which is pretty impressive
|
|
|
Post by hifinutt on Dec 18, 2023 10:07:55 GMT
hows it going with the teac ? been a few weeks now . i think you said its silent in operation, is that still the case ?
|
|
|
Post by macca on Dec 18, 2023 18:54:29 GMT
hows it going with the teac ? been a few weeks now . i think you said its silent in operation, is that still the case ? Yes, I can't fault it. Was listening to Keith Richards 'Main Offender' yesterday afternoon and the sound really stopped me in my tracks. I mean it is a good production but even so it just sounded so right, especially the tone on the guitars. I think I mentioned in the original review but back when I was using the beloved Sony SCD XB930 I used to have a chuckle because the sound was sometimes so sweet it seemed it just could not really be truthful. When it died I really missed that. With the Audiolab transport sound was good but I did not ever have a chuckle over the sweetness. Now same DAC with different transport and I have that sweetness back. It doesn't have any mechanical noise at all.
|
|
|
Post by hifinutt on Dec 18, 2023 19:36:42 GMT
Thanks macca , its fairly high on my bucket list
Wonder what the clock would do ? If its worth spending on
|
|
Bigman80
Grandmaster
The HiFi Bear/Audioaddicts/Bigbottle Owner
Posts: 16,398
|
Post by Bigman80 on Dec 18, 2023 19:46:31 GMT
Thanks macca , its fairly high on my bucket list Wonder what the clock would do ? If its worth spending on Both devices (701T&701N) have 10mhz input capability. I'd run the TEAC clock controlling the two, and be happy with that......if the 701N didnt have a HF rolloff. 🥺
|
|
|
Post by macca on Dec 18, 2023 20:21:09 GMT
I do fancy the 701N - I would really like to know if it does have that roll-off but there's just nothing else out there other than that NK review.
Why would they do that? It just makes no sense.
I think mine is still the only review of the 701T. TEAC marketing division asleep at the switch?
|
|
Bigman80
Grandmaster
The HiFi Bear/Audioaddicts/Bigbottle Owner
Posts: 16,398
|
Post by Bigman80 on Dec 18, 2023 20:53:23 GMT
I do fancy the 701N - I would really like to know if it does have that roll-off but there's just nothing else out there other than that NK review. Why would they do that? It just makes no sense. I think mine is still the only review of the 701T. TEAC marketing division asleep at the switch? It feels that way. It's not hard the measure linearity or frequency response, so I suspect it's true, which is such a shame as it puts me off. Whether you'd miss that 0.5db at 10-20khz, who knows, but it's a massive wrinkle in the fabric for me. It would bother me, and I know it. In truth, I've been hoping ASR got hold of one. No luck as of yet. Maybe worth asking TEAC directly?
|
|
Arke
Moderator
Posts: 1,259
|
Post by Arke on Dec 18, 2023 21:08:43 GMT
I do fancy the 701N - I would really like to know if it does have that roll-off but there's just nothing else out there other than that NK review. Why would they do that? It just makes no sense. I think mine is still the only review of the 701T. TEAC marketing division asleep at the switch? It feels that way. It's not hard the measure linearity or frequency response, so I suspect it's true, which is such a shame as it puts me off. Whether you'd miss that 0.5db at 10-20khz, who knows, but it's a massive wrinkle in the fabric for me. It would bother me, and I know it. In truth, I've been hoping ASR got hold of one. No luck as of yet. Maybe worth asking TEAC directly? It's about 4db down at 20KHz according to the linked measurements. Probably not super obvious to many ears. The reviewer seems to imply it's done to deliver a smoother sound.
|
|
Bigman80
Grandmaster
The HiFi Bear/Audioaddicts/Bigbottle Owner
Posts: 16,398
|
Post by Bigman80 on Dec 18, 2023 21:10:42 GMT
It feels that way. It's not hard the measure linearity or frequency response, so I suspect it's true, which is such a shame as it puts me off. Whether you'd miss that 0.5db at 10-20khz, who knows, but it's a massive wrinkle in the fabric for me. It would bother me, and I know it. In truth, I've been hoping ASR got hold of one. No luck as of yet. Maybe worth asking TEAC directly? It's about 4db down at 20KHz according to the linked measurements. Probably not super obvious to many ears. The reviewer seems to imply it's done to deliver a smoother sound. Ah, thanks Jason. I could have checked for accuracy.. I actually think it may be because of the TEAC amplifier. It's Hypex, and Hypex can be edgy...(IME) I wonder if they have rolled off that top end for that reason?
|
|