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Post by dsjr on Jul 12, 2018 8:49:00 GMT
So, what phono stage have you settled with then?
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Post by antonio on Jul 12, 2018 8:49:36 GMT
Well done Biggy, I noted it wasn't advertised on AoS.  |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 12, 2018 9:14:22 GMT
So, what phono stage have you settled with then? Hi Dave, I've settled with my DIY valve phonostage, The Wizard. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 12, 2018 15:55:01 GMT
So, what phono stage have you settled with then? Hi Dave, I've settled with my DIY valve phonostage, The Wizard. Well not surprised it's been snapped up but I thought you admitted this is the best you have had. I think there will be demands for you to produce 'The Wizard' at a bake off. Something impartial were certain people and product are not banned. I hope this decision wasn't influenced by some knob head at AOS.  |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 12, 2018 16:51:59 GMT
Hi Dave, I've settled with my DIY valve phonostage, The Wizard. Well not surprised it's been snapped up but I thought you admitted this is the best you have had. I think there will be demands for you to produce 'The Wizard' at a bake off. Something impartial were certain people and product are not banned. I hope this decision wasn't influenced by some knob head at AOS. Hi CR, No, i don't recall saying it was the "Best I've had" in fact, i don't recall saying ANYTHING about it anywhere in terms of my feelings towards it's performance. Please feel free to provide the text if i have! It would be nice to know if my brain is failing lol Selling it on shouldn't be presumed to be performance related. Again, i haven't said why its been sold on. I think its important to also recognize that i haven't said what reasons led to my decision to sell it on and keep the Wizard. No one ANYWHERE influences my decisions. Not here, AoS, HFS, TAS, anywhere. I refuse to be forced into anything i don't want to do and i think my decision to buy and try the NVA2 in my own home, should prove that i do whatever i want to. I am happy to bring the Wizard to a bakeoff but lets have it right, The only way to TRULY be impartial is if the voting listeners were blind to the Phonostage in use, the person doing the installation of the phonostage were not allowed a vote and then judged it, purely on sound alone. This is ideal in my eyes and something i'd love to see happen. If this could happen, id be happy to attend. If someone wanted to do a private bake off for their own experience then i am happy with that too. I have a private bakeoff against a Tom Evans Mastergroove on the horizon. That will be interesting! |
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Post by macca on Jul 12, 2018 17:18:58 GMT
You should have said 'Yes', Oli, wind him up a bit.
Opportunity lost there mate.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 12, 2018 17:27:41 GMT
You should have said 'Yes', Oli, wind him up a bit. Opportunity lost there mate. 😂 No mate, just want a nice smooth sale with no drama. |
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Jul 12, 2018 17:33:31 GMT
As this is a sale thread, it’s not the best place to ask, but Oliver has answered anyway.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 12, 2018 20:38:35 GMT
Really, I should sell my own Phono 2/PSU, as I don't have vinyl sources ideally worthy of it - and then I put a record on and I know I'd regret it... It's a couple of years now, but I remember the subtle improvement in the bass that the second PSU offered, even on the Sh#t decks it's used with here - the difference is rather more than just a response change, as it's the feel of the bass that changes. All moot now. I hope the new owner can further exploit it's considerable talents at the job it has to do... Well, there's no Sh#t deck here lol, the source of the signal was as good as it gets for working man's wages, as far as I'm concerned anyway. The second PSU actually does more than help the bass, it improved resolution across the whole frequency range. I thought the mid-bass benefitted especially. The second PSU is essential to get out what this is capable of and I suspect the BBPSU is probably going to give you more. I liked i. Id hang on to yours, Dave. No point selling it as you'll regret it, as you say. It's not costing you anything to sit there. I think you put it in a nutshell hence I was pulling your leg a bit. I think you will regret that sale. Your home brew will have to be good. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 12, 2018 20:41:31 GMT
Dave I know your loyalty and commitment to the shiney black plastic that is NVA knows no bounds, but you must let biggy decide Whats best for him, its his money his choice and more importantly his ears. Each to their own. I think some of us NVA enthusiasts can't help pointing out a bad decision purely on sound terms. No agenda. Of course it's Biggy's decision and he can do as he likes. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 12, 2018 21:06:24 GMT
Dave I know your loyalty and commitment to the shiney black plastic that is NVA knows no bounds, but you must let biggy decide Whats best for him, its his money his choice and more importantly his ears. Each to their own. I think some of us NVA enthusiasts can't help pointing out a bad decision purely on sound terms. No agenda. Of course it's Biggy's decision and he can do as he likes. Well, bad decision "In your opinion" <you needed to add that bit in You see, HiFi is a bit like women. You try a (fair) few out, some are beautiful but dim, some are intellectual but boring etc but when you find the one that does it for YOU, you hang on to her. HiFi is all about finding what is right for you, not someone else. My opinion on what you listen too shouldn't matter one iota. The Wizard doesn't have to be amazing, it just has to be right for me or going in the right direction. Same as the SP10, some folk don't like them. I love it so i have one. What you have over at HFS, is a group of people who all share a similar taste in what they like HiFi & Music to sound like. That's quite rare, as everywhere else, the mix is eclectic. If someone on the forum suggests a cheap Chinese DAC is rather good, the probability is that most of the membership will agree because the collective share the same taste. You see it with the First Watt group too. All i want to do is find what I like and figure it out for myself, which is why my path as been a bit tangential. I am also happy to not belong to any single way of thinking. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 12, 2018 21:54:51 GMT
I think some of us NVA enthusiasts can't help pointing out a bad decision purely on sound terms. No agenda. Of course it's Biggy's decision and he can do as he likes. Well, bad decision "In your opinion" <you needed to add that bit in You see, HiFi is a bit like women. You try a (fair) few out, some are beautiful but dim, some are intellectual but boring etc but when you find the one that does it for YOU, you hang on to her. HiFi is all about finding what is right for you, not someone else. My opinion on what you listen too shouldn't matter one iota. The Wizard doesn't have to be amazing, it just has to be right for me or going in the right direction. Same as the SP10, some folk don't like them. I love it so i have one. What you have over at HFS, is a group of people who all share a similar taste in what they like HiFi & Music to sound like. That's quite rare, as everywhere else, the mix is eclectic. If someone on the forum suggests a cheap Chinese DAC is rather good, the probability is that most of the membership will agree because the collective share the same taste. You see it with the First Watt group too. All i want to do is find what I like and figure it out for myself, which is why my path as been a bit tangential. I am also happy to not belong to any single way of thinking. I don't think there is a single way of thinking over on HFS. Some people have tried cheap ideas suggested and liked them. I don't think anyone has claimed the £50 DAC betters something really well designed and a lot more pricey. There are a small number of people continually posting about their Doc Mods or Semi omni designs but most of us can't be bothered with DIY. I don't think you will find DSJR is an out an out semi omni enthusiast but RD played him the DAC and he tried it. I certainly don't have anything like an all NVA set up. Real reason I was having a bit of a dig is that you are a bit of a box swapper and yet again the latest is the greatest. In a few weeks or months you will come across something better and it might be the Phono 2 again. I think you need longer with a piece of kit to appreciate it's worth or find it's ultimate flaws. Then determine if you can live with it long term. I'm serious when I say you won't find anything genuinely superior to the Phono 2 without spending a lot more money. |
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Post by macca on Jul 12, 2018 22:39:43 GMT
If you not entirely sure what sort of presentation you want box swapping is the best way to find out. Then you can zoom in on the sort of thing that does it for you.
If you ever want to revisit something it's rare you can't find one for sale somewhere. Or even buy the same one back. That's happened.
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Post by savvypaul on Jul 12, 2018 22:50:22 GMT
I think some of us NVA enthusiasts can't help pointing out a bad decision purely on sound terms. No agenda. Of course it's Biggy's decision and he can do as he likes. Well, bad decision "In your opinion" <you needed to add that bit in You see, HiFi is a bit like women. You try a (fair) few out, some are beautiful but dim, some are intellectual but boring etc but when you find the one that does it for YOU, you hang on to her. HiFi is all about finding what is right for you, not someone else. My opinion on what you listen too shouldn't matter one iota. The Wizard doesn't have to be amazing, it just has to be right for me or going in the right direction. Same as the SP10, some folk don't like them. I love it so i have one. What you have over at HFS, is a group of people who all share a similar taste in what they like HiFi & Music to sound like. That's quite rare, as everywhere else, the mix is eclectic. If someone on the forum suggests a cheap Chinese DAC is rather good, the probability is that most of the membership will agree because the collective share the same taste. You see it with the First Watt group too. All i want to do is find what I like and figure it out for myself, which is why my path as been a bit tangential. I am also happy to not belong to any single way of thinking. Nothing wrong with box swapping. Nothing wrong with not box swapping. Along the way, we learn who to listen to and who to ignore. Using your own analogy, Oliver, you seem to suggest that HFS members are both beautiful and intelligent  |
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Post by macca on Jul 12, 2018 23:14:55 GMT
Why would you want to listen to anyone? You try stuff you fancy in your own home and you work it out yourself. If there is another way to getting what you as an individual wants I'd like to know. Ignore everyone and just try stuff you fancy is my advice. Which everyone should ignore.  |
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Jul 12, 2018 23:56:34 GMT
FWIW I agree. I think it’s even more important to avoid listening to people who appear to like the same stuff and display similar tastes because it’s unlikely you will have ALL the same preferences.
Even in my NVA system days, I didn’t try a Phono 1or 2 despite the “group think” over them. I had owned a handful of NVA amps earlier on and experienced both MM and MC phono stages as well as multiple PSUs. One was even newly installed for me, so no doubts about it being to spec. I thought they were all pretty poor and as the circuit apparently hadn’t changed, I wasn’t willing to give the new models a further spin.
I fell for group think and ignored my own instincts with the speaker cable though. Tried LS1 and thought it was the worst cable I’d ever heard. A few years later I tried it again because everyone else loved it. Then I tried it again. Still awful to me, so I tried LS3 and LS5 which are more of the same thing! Guess what, more awfulness. LS6 was much better but still wasn’t my Goldilocks cable: Due, I suspect, to the presence of the same base cable I hadn’t liked alongside one I clearly did like.
All the other NVA gear I have either liked or loved, but if I had gone with the herd and done it all in the same way, I would’ve ended up with a worse sound.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 12, 2018 23:59:15 GMT
Well, bad decision "In your opinion" <you needed to add that bit in You see, HiFi is a bit like women. You try a (fair) few out, some are beautiful but dim, some are intellectual but boring etc but when you find the one that does it for YOU, you hang on to her. HiFi is all about finding what is right for you, not someone else. My opinion on what you listen too shouldn't matter one iota. The Wizard doesn't have to be amazing, it just has to be right for me or going in the right direction. Same as the SP10, some folk don't like them. I love it so i have one. What you have over at HFS, is a group of people who all share a similar taste in what they like HiFi & Music to sound like. That's quite rare, as everywhere else, the mix is eclectic. If someone on the forum suggests a cheap Chinese DAC is rather good, the probability is that most of the membership will agree because the collective share the same taste. You see it with the First Watt group too. All i want to do is find what I like and figure it out for myself, which is why my path as been a bit tangential. I am also happy to not belong to any single way of thinking. Nothing wrong with box swapping. Nothing wrong with not box swapping. Along the way, we learn who to listen to and who to ignore. Using your own analogy, Oliver, you seem to suggest that HFS members are both beautiful and intelligent Exactly lol 😉 What I am trying to say is that we all naturally gravitate towards those who hear what we hear and we tend to heed the advice given to us by people whose opinion we know suits our musically. HFS has this because you are all (mostly) NVA users which confirms what I said earlier. I wasn't suggesting the new cheap DAC was the best thing ever, I said you'd all probably share in its qualities because you're all of a like mind as to what you like to hear!! |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 13, 2018 0:20:29 GMT
Well, bad decision "In your opinion" <you needed to add that bit in You see, HiFi is a bit like women. You try a (fair) few out, some are beautiful but dim, some are intellectual but boring etc but when you find the one that does it for YOU, you hang on to her. HiFi is all about finding what is right for you, not someone else. My opinion on what you listen too shouldn't matter one iota. The Wizard doesn't have to be amazing, it just has to be right for me or going in the right direction. Same as the SP10, some folk don't like them. I love it so i have one. What you have over at HFS, is a group of people who all share a similar taste in what they like HiFi & Music to sound like. That's quite rare, as everywhere else, the mix is eclectic. If someone on the forum suggests a cheap Chinese DAC is rather good, the probability is that most of the membership will agree because the collective share the same taste. You see it with the First Watt group too. All i want to do is find what I like and figure it out for myself, which is why my path as been a bit tangential. I am also happy to not belong to any single way of thinking. I don't think there is a single way of thinking over on HFS. Some people have tried cheap ideas suggested and liked them. I don't think anyone has claimed the £50 DAC betters something really well designed and a lot more pricey. There are a small number of people continually posting about their Doc Mods or Semi omni designs but most of us can't be bothered with DIY. I don't think you will find DSJR is an out an out semi omni enthusiast but RD played him the DAC and he tried it. I certainly don't have anything like an all NVA set up. Real reason I was having a bit of a dig is that you are a bit of a box swapper and yet again the latest is the greatest. In a few weeks or months you will come across something better and it might be the Phono 2 again. I think you need longer with a piece of kit to appreciate it's worth or find it's ultimate flaws. Then determine if you can live with it long term. I'm serious when I say you won't find anything genuinely superior to the Phono 2 without spending a lot more money. "Real reason I was having a bit of a dig is that you are a bit of a box swapper and yet again the latest is the greatest" Why have a dig? Again, show me where I have said anything was "the greatest"?. It seems to be a personal affront to you that I have decided to sell it. I alert you once again to the fact that I haven't said ANYTHING was the "latest greatest" thing and that in actual fact you're comment out there that I haven't said. Please demonstrate where I said either phonostage was the "latest greatest" thing or words to that effect. Also, you make an assumption about how long I have owned that unit, may I point out that you have no clue how long I've had it. You only know that I sold it today/yesterday. "I'm serious when I say you won't find anything genuinely superior to the Phono 2 without spending a lot more money" Again, this is only your opinion. One you're entitled to but why is everything about "superior". Can I not just prefer the presentation of something else? Is the NVA superior to EVERYTHING under its £800 pricetag??? Have you listened to them to be sure? "I think you need longer with a piece of kit to appreciate it's worth or find it's ultimate flaws" I disagree entirely. There will usually be a flaw that is apparent very quickly and usually it's something I listen for. If it's got the flaw, I already know I can't live with it so it doesn't last long. Only things that don't immediately show a flaw last here. Then it gets an extended stay and I start to test it against other equipment. Which is the only way to know for sure. The Kontrapunkt b didn't show any flaws until I put it in against a £2k cartridge then its limitations were apparent. I will upgrade the cartridge when i can. I'm not sure how else anyone else does it but I compare things and move on what I no longer want. |
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Post by savvypaul on Jul 13, 2018 6:01:09 GMT
Why would you want to listen to anyone? You try stuff you fancy in your own home and you work it out yourself. If there is another way to getting what you as an individual wants I'd like to know. Ignore everyone and just try stuff you fancy is my advice. Which everyone should ignore. Because no-one can listen to everything.We necessarily narrow down what to listen to by what we read and who we choose to take notice of. Of course, trust your own ears and make up your own mind. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 13, 2018 7:12:28 GMT
Why would you want to listen to anyone? You try stuff you fancy in your own home and you work it out yourself. If there is another way to getting what you as an individual wants I'd like to know. Ignore everyone and just try stuff you fancy is my advice. Which everyone should ignore. Because no-one can listen to everything.We necessarily narrow down what to listen to by what we read and who we choose to take notice of. Of course, trust your own ears and make up your own mind. That's what I've been trying to say in the previous posts we take the advice of people whose opinion is similar to our own there is nothing wrong with that but ultimately the decision on whether we keep something will be based upon our own listening and that is how it should be |
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Post by savvypaul on Jul 13, 2018 7:24:28 GMT
Nothing wrong with box swapping. Nothing wrong with not box swapping. Along the way, we learn who to listen to and who to ignore. Using your own analogy, Oliver, you seem to suggest that HFS members are both beautiful and intelligent Exactly lol 😉 What I am trying to say is that we all naturally gravitate towards those who hear what we hear and we tend to heed the advice given to us by people whose opinion we know suits our musically. HFS has this because you are all (mostly) NVA users which confirms what I said earlier. I wasn't suggesting the new cheap DAC was the best thing ever, I said you'd all probably share in its qualities because you're all of a like mind as to what you like to hear!! A chap who comes to my bake-offs owns valve amps and big Tannoys. He tried the £5 DAC and £40 LPS and thinks it's excellent. Displaced his own £300 DAC. He's a very experienced audiophile. He's a member of several forums, including HFS. Your comments about HFS are far too general. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 13, 2018 7:34:15 GMT
Exactly lol 😉 What I am trying to say is that we all naturally gravitate towards those who hear what we hear and we tend to heed the advice given to us by people whose opinion we know suits our musically. HFS has this because you are all (mostly) NVA users which confirms what I said earlier. I wasn't suggesting the new cheap DAC was the best thing ever, I said you'd all probably share in its qualities because you're all of a like mind as to what you like to hear!! A chap who comes to my bake-offs owns valve amps and big Tannoys. He tried the £5 DAC and £40 LPS and thinks it's excellent. Displaced his own £300 DAC. He's a very experienced audiophile. He's a member of several forums, including HFS. Your comments about HFS are far too general. Yet your example proves my point! He has replaced his DAC with the cheap Chinese one so will in future listen to the recommendations made from the person who introduced it to him. |
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Post by savvypaul on Jul 13, 2018 7:36:15 GMT
Because no-one can listen to everything.We necessarily narrow down what to listen to by what we read and who we choose to take notice of. Of course, trust your own ears and make up your own mind. That's what I've been trying to say in the previous posts we take the advice of people whose opinion is similar to our own there is nothing wrong with that but ultimately the decision on whether we keep something will be based upon our own listening and that is how it should be I seek advice from people with greater knowledge and experience than myself. It's not about finding people who agree with you...it's about finding people who can challenge you and make you think and learn. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 13, 2018 7:38:39 GMT
i think dsjr is the man i'de take notice of above anyone else i have ever met on ANY forum..imho the man's a genius with hifi..
if i ever need some advice he'll be my only port of call
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Post by savvypaul on Jul 13, 2018 7:42:04 GMT
A chap who comes to my bake-offs owns valve amps and big Tannoys. He tried the £5 DAC and £40 LPS and thinks it's excellent. Displaced his own £300 DAC. He's a very experienced audiophile. He's a member of several forums, including HFS. Your comments about HFS are far too general. Yet your example proves my point! He has replaced his DAC with the cheap Chinese one so will in future listen to the recommendations made from the person who introduced it to him. My example demonstrates that he is capable of independent thought. I agree, though, if someone finds a £50 item that no-one else is talking about that then outperforms more expensive kit, and if they are sharing that information for zero commercial gain, then...yes, I would be inclined to value their opinion. |
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Post by macca on Jul 13, 2018 7:45:40 GMT
Nevertheless there is, in my opinion, a 'one true way' vibe amongst the vocal NVA users - currently being propagated on this thread by Classicrock.
Maybe you don't think that but it is how it comes across. Like one of those cults 'Your free to leave any time but first you must explain why.'
And 'It's not really the sound I'm after' doesn't seem to get accepted as an explanation. It's all a bit weird.
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Jul 13, 2018 7:54:34 GMT
I agree. It’s seen on either furums too, AVi for one, or if you really want to go through the looking glass, try Lejonklou.
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Post by macca on Jul 13, 2018 8:01:22 GMT
Yes AVI is another one.
'Hey AVI speakers are intrinsically better because they're active ' No sorry mate, it doesn't really work that way...
Never heard of Lejonklou, had to look it up.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 13, 2018 8:01:54 GMT
I steer well clear of makes that people can't stop blathering about.
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Jul 13, 2018 8:03:50 GMT
i think dsjr is the man i'de take notice of above anyone else i have ever met on ANY forum..imho the man's a genius with hifi.. if i ever need some advice he'll be my only port of call Dave and I have different tastes but that doesn’t devalue his advice because it is packed with knowledge and useful info about design. I can always factor in any element of having different ears. |
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