Bigman80
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The HiFi Bear/Audioaddicts/Bigbottle Owner
Posts: 16,400
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Post by Bigman80 on Sept 22, 2020 10:03:43 GMT
I just thought i would post this here, seeing as the Houdini is a topic of interest to some.
I was contacted a couple of days ago by an aspiring HiFi dealer about "trialing & Reviewing" the Houdini............I have rejected the opportunity.
What i am being told is that this little device is being given to those deemed "influencial" in the HiFi forum world, in order to drum up some momentum to drive sales of this unit. Some of these have been given out, free of charge to said "influencers"
Whilst there is nothing wrong with giving out free samples, i do feel it's rather underhanded to give an opinion of the performance of something, IF you don't mention that you got it for free.
Unfortunatly, there also appears to be a lot of posts on appearing on forums, starting with "I dont normally write on forums, but the Houdini......."
They are basically carbon copies of the same post too. It's happened on WW,PFM and here earlier, by a new member who has now been deleted, blocked and his post removed.
This is an obvious marketing or selling tactic and i for one am not having it here.
IF any member buys one, and wishes to post their thoughts on their PURCHASE, i welcome your thoughts on the subject.
If you were given one free of charge, you may also post your thoughts on it, BUT i insist you declare it's origin and it cost to you.
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Post by firebottle on Sept 22, 2020 10:42:50 GMT
I can't really see the problem Oli, apart from the advertising aspect on here, but you do offer free trade space.
From what I can see you can trial the Houdini with a money back offer if not satisfied.
Admittedly some I am sure have been sent out free gratis, but wouldn't you if you were in the right position and had a new product to market?
I am in two minds to trial it myself.
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Sept 22, 2020 10:50:56 GMT
I can't really see the problem Oli, apart from the advertising aspect on here, but you do offer free trade space. From what I can see you can trial the Houdini with a money back offer if not satisfied. Admittedly some I am sure have been sent out free gratis, but wouldn't you if you were in the right position and had a new product to market? I am in two minds to trial it myself. I'm not against the generating of momentum or it's gaining of popularity, but the post this morning talked of how much of a bargain it was etc....without any acknowledgement of how much they paid for it, or if they did. Just felt a little bit "dirty" to me. Of course, I could be wrong, and if the general consensus think I am, then I accept it. I just like to know that I'm reading owner reviews, and not bought or bribed reviews. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 22, 2020 11:51:08 GMT
I have ordered one. The money back guarantee is enough for me, especially as AK promised to give me £5 worth of smarties if I don't like it.
I will be honest with my thoughts, as there is nothing in it for me either way.
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Bigman80
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The HiFi Bear/Audioaddicts/Bigbottle Owner
Posts: 16,400
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Post by Bigman80 on Sept 22, 2020 12:00:35 GMT
I have ordered one. The money back guarantee is enough for me, especially as AK promised to give me £5 worth of smarties if I don't like it. I will be honest with my thoughts, as there is nothing in it for me either way. PERFECT! Thank you Kevin. I'd like to know what genuine purchasers of this item really think of it, so i am really looking forward to your thoughts. Bravo! |
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Post by sq225917 on Sept 22, 2020 12:02:47 GMT
I know Ynwoan is being sent one to demo on a loan basis. Its smart marketing, but anyone receiving one gratis should be honour bound to let people know the back story.
Whatever next, hose pipe wobbly arm tubes, floppy headshells?
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Post by karma67 on Sept 22, 2020 12:08:08 GMT
Some are being offered it for £105
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Post by macca on Sept 22, 2020 12:34:01 GMT
The problem is if someone is given a product by the maker for free and it turns out they don't think much of it then it is much harder for them to say so.
Likewise if the maker is a friend, or someone they like/get on with.
Or if their income depends on reviewing (like the mags or the You-tube people), if they give poor reviews then makers stop sending them stuff to review and their income vanishes.
There's not really any way around that unless you have zero financial interest and you don't mind losing friends and pissing people off.
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Post by electronumpty on Sept 22, 2020 13:13:32 GMT
The "Houdini" effect, makes your money disappear....
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 22, 2020 13:25:16 GMT
Some are being offered it for £105 Where did you see that? |
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Post by karma67 on Sept 22, 2020 14:11:19 GMT
Some are being offered it for £105 Where did you see that? It was me via pfm. |
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Sept 22, 2020 14:16:03 GMT
Some folks paying full price, others being offered it at £105 and gratis for the select few. I'd be pissed off if I'd paid up. |
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Sept 22, 2020 14:20:51 GMT
The problem is if someone is given a product by the maker for free and it turns out they don't think much of it then it is much harder for them to say so. Likewise if the maker is a friend, or someone they like/get on with. Or if their income depends on reviewing (like the mags or the You-tube people), if they give poor reviews then makers stop sending them stuff to review and their income vanishes. There's not really any way around that unless you have zero financial interest and you don't mind losing friends and pissing people off. Exactly...... They are trapped by it being free, unless they are fearless with their comments. This is the exact reason I want to know whether the comments are from a fully paid up owner or not. Although a paid up owner is unlikely to label it as snake oil as they won't be able to move it on after. |
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Post by karma67 on Sept 22, 2020 16:00:46 GMT
Some folks paying full price, others being offered it at £105 and gratis for the select few. I'd be pissed off if I'd paid up. so would i,i'd send it back on principle . |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 22, 2020 16:39:01 GMT
You are confusing the money Funk get paid for each one when sold at full retail through the usual dealer channels. As far as I know, it has never been offered at £105. Yes, some people, like Marco, are getting sent them free. That is normal with marketing. |
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Post by karma67 on Sept 22, 2020 17:39:06 GMT
You are confusing the money Funk get paid for each one when sold at full retail through the usual dealer channels. As far as I know, it has never been offered at £105. Yes, some people, like Marco, are getting sent them free. That is normal with marketing. im not confusing anything mate,i was offered it for £105 via pm by the guy doing the marketing on pfm. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 22, 2020 17:59:50 GMT
Interesting. I shall ask about that...
I have not paid for mine yet, but I have not received it either.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 22, 2020 18:18:02 GMT
It seems a select few were picked at the discounted price to try and get a few reviews out there. It appears I was not on the list...
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Sept 22, 2020 18:38:34 GMT
It seems a select few were picked at the discounted price to try and get a few reviews out there. It appears I was not on the list... Select few? It's shocking behaviour imo. Sorry. I have seen the evidence....they were offered by "Matt" at around 1300 on Friday 19th September. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 22, 2020 19:28:31 GMT
I can understand why you want some out there, but I think it is a mistake offering them to a few for £105.
How can you then ask for £300?
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bigbird
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Post by bigbird on Sept 22, 2020 20:20:24 GMT
Maybe you should have accepted the offer then sent it out to all the forum members who were interested in trying it with no obligation, to use in their own system for a week or so, then they send it onto the next in the queue.each person just pays postage. Then everybody can write their honest thoughts on a new ‘funk thread’ . Then we would get an idea of how it works with different arm / cart combos.
If the freebie was then still bothering you, it could be sold on eBay and a charitable donation made ?
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Sept 22, 2020 20:59:40 GMT
I can understand why you want some out there, but I think it is a mistake offering them to a few for £105. How can you then ask for £300? Exactly.....he's mugging off the people who he doesn't "fancy" for a discount. It's certainly not the first time I've heard things like this, and it won't be the last. |
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Sept 22, 2020 21:01:44 GMT
Maybe you should have accepted the offer then sent it out to all the forum members who were interested in trying it with no obligation, to use in their own system for a week or so, then they send it onto the next in the queue.each person just pays postage. Then everybody can write their honest thoughts on a new ‘funk thread’ . Then we would get an idea of how it works with different arm / cart combos. If the freebie was then still bothering you, it could be sold on eBay and a charitable donation made ? That's a good point. Unfortunately I am a selfish twat and did not think of this very good idea 🤣🤣 Think it's probably too late now lol |
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Post by stevew on Sept 22, 2020 21:18:22 GMT
It’s a shame
What may well be an excellent product is being oversold and in grave danger of damaging the brand.
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Sept 22, 2020 21:28:09 GMT
It’s a shame What may well be an excellent product is being oversold and in grave danger of damaging the brand. It is a shame....but what you guys are seeing is a very common practice, probably for the first time. The price of the thing isn't really an issue, as that's a pretty standard ratio for a commercial product. £300 usually means about £50-75ish build cost, the rest is profit which pays back to time spent developing the thing. All that is normal, What isn't ok is selling them to certain people for one price, and other people for more. It's just not cricket. If you're gonna do an introductory offer to drum up interest, then don't for an advertised period of time. If folk miss out when it's expired, then it's everyone that misses out after that time. Simple. |
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bigbird
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Post by bigbird on Sept 22, 2020 21:36:41 GMT
Oh you twat, you’ve ruined it for the rest of us haha.
I’d try one for 105 quid . Worth a punt at that price , but 300 seems a lot for a little piece of plastic.
I’m also concerned about the way it ‘deletes the tonearm’ . I bought my arm because I like the way it sounds. If it deletes the arm ,is there any need to buy a high end arm ? Can you just use something half decent instead and save yourself a fortune?
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Bigman80
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Posts: 16,400
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Post by Bigman80 on Sept 22, 2020 21:42:03 GMT
Oh you twat, you’ve ruined it for the rest of us haha. I’d try one for 105 quid . Worth a punt at that price , but 300 seems a lot for a little piece of plastic. I’m also concerned about the way it ‘deletes the tonearm’ . I bought my arm because I like the way it sounds. If it deletes the arm ,is there any need to buy a high end arm ? Can you just use something half decent instead and save yourself a fortune? I'm not sold on this theory of its purpose at all. When i asked Angus what the one thing I could do totally ruin everything the cart TT and plinth are trying to do, he said "Buy a Houdini" 🤣🤣 I genuinely hope it does advertised, as there is more than enough snake oil in this hobby. |
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bigbird
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Post by bigbird on Sept 22, 2020 21:49:22 GMT
You best go back with your tail between your legs and tell them that the people of the forum have spoken and they would like to try one 😜
Then we can all decide for ourselves
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 22, 2020 22:05:34 GMT
Oh you twat, you’ve ruined it for the rest of us haha. I’d try one for 105 quid . Worth a punt at that price , but 300 seems a lot for a little piece of plastic. I’m also concerned about the way it ‘deletes the tonearm’ . I bought my arm because I like the way it sounds. If it deletes the arm ,is there any need to buy a high end arm ? Can you just use something half decent instead and save yourself a fortune? I'm not sold on this theory of its purpose at all. When i asked Angus what the one thing I could do totally ruin everything the cart TT and plinth are trying to do, he said "Buy a Houdini" 🤣🤣 I genuinely hope it does advertised, as there is more than enough snake oil in this hobby. If that is a serious comment, then that worries me about narrow mindedness. AK is a pretty clever guy and knows about vinyl replay, having created some iconic products. Sure, quality was an issue in the past, but I don’t think he would waste three years of his time and release a product on to the market on something that was not worth the effort. |
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Sept 22, 2020 22:18:18 GMT
I'm not sold on this theory of its purpose at all. When i asked Angus what the one thing I could do totally ruin everything the cart TT and plinth are trying to do, he said "Buy a Houdini" 🤣🤣 I genuinely hope it does advertised, as there is more than enough snake oil in this hobby. If that is a serious comment, then that worries me about narrow mindedness. AK is a pretty clever guy and knows about vinyl replay, having created some iconic products. Sure, quality was an issue in the past, but I don’t think he would waste three years of his time and release a product on to the market on something that was not worth the effort. Now come on Kevin, when have you ever known me to rule anything out before I have tried it? Never..... I give the benefit of the doubt to everything, including the much maligned grounding boxes that were deemed snake oil long before anyone had tried one. I stuck up for the ground box, as I heard one make a significant difference for the better...and then for the worse. As I say, I sincerely hope that the Houdini does what it says in the tin. If you say to me that it works, then I'll accept it works. The proof will be in the keeping of it, but I shall remain sceptical ......... for now. |
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