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Post by gninnam on Jun 6, 2020 10:11:03 GMT
OK - will leave the 'slayer' comments out of this (for now). I hear what you are saying regards a collaborative effort to an extent but still fair play to you! I'm enjoying Alan's Firebottle OPT MK2 which I find works well in my system and have used a few different phono preamps over the years so intrigued with this one. I think you are in Nottingham or some such place - I am in Leeds to a good few hours for each of us so not so easy to 'pop' round  Yes, once this madness has subsided I will probably take a trek down to your gaff to have a listen and hear what great work has been done. Oh well, if you're using a OTPMK2, you certainly have to come and have a listen to the Bigbottle phonostage......good times ahead! Well - its a date then (I'll be the one with the red carnation in my lapel  ) |
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Jun 6, 2020 10:14:39 GMT
Oh well, if you're using a OTPMK2, you certainly have to come and have a listen to the Bigbottle phonostage......good times ahead! Well - its a date then (I'll be the one with the red carnation in my lapel ) Hahaha....I'll keep an eye out  |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 6, 2020 10:49:49 GMT
Well, for anyone yet to take the plunge, I would encourage you to put away your doubts because for the outlay and effort, I can guarantee that you will not find anything to better the modded BB3 (BB4?) for the money....anywhere, or at twice the price come to that.
This is in no small part due to Oli and Alan's willingness to listen to feedback, look seriously at both any concerns raised as well as to potential improvements or room for improvement areas, then to properly investigate and action those points. Oli has project managed this like a true champ and Alan has been out of the starting blocks so quickly on occasion that a re-start has been ordered by the umpire!
People who know me, know that I am honest and tell things as they are. I don't embroider performance when it comes to hifi as my own job and past profession was pretty surgical in analysis, detail and getting results through adopting thorough procedures and applying sound design principles.
This is what is going on here. There are step improvements and I think that Oli is being too modest in parts. The latest very rapid progression with E&I traffos, multi-fet boards, and Alan's cleaver little soft stop device have, with a good dollop of valve rolling too, resulted in significant steps forwards.
May I drop in a suggestion which will also help people? How about we draft a list of valves known to work well with V1, V2 and V3?
I've had literally dozens of phonotstages through here from modest little Gram Amp 1's through to ££££'s worth of kit. This BB3(4!) sits proudly in the middle, and that's no mean feat.
Anyone handy to me who is too far away from Oli or others with one of these is welcome to come and listen to mine when lockdown ends. It won't take much convincing for you to take the leap of faith as hearing is believing.
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Post by firebottle on Jun 6, 2020 11:48:41 GMT
Many thanks for the vote of confidence Paul, much appreciated by both of us.
A couple of words about valve rolling and the circuit design. The first stage specifically tries to trick the valve into thinking it is in valve utopia by providing a very large effective anode load, so V1 rolling gives a lesser effect than V2.
V2 is a 'traditional' valve gain stage so will show differences more readily with different valves/makes.
V3 is a cathode follower to provide a low output impedance so also has a lesser effect on sound with valve rolling, IMO the least.
Valves known to provide excellent performance include the following:
V1 - Telefunken
V2 - General Electric 12AX7WA. A low cost alternative is the Russian 6N2P-EV, not quite as good but for the money very acceptable.
V3 - Telefunken, I use a Matsushita PCC88/7DG8 to good effect. You can also use a PCC189 in this position.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 6, 2020 12:17:57 GMT
I've found that trying quite a few valves now that if V1 is at all microphonic, it carries through the circuit, and swapping just that one out seems to largely cure any microphany issues.
V2, agreed, has the largest impact on sound character for want of a better term.
I'm waiting for a set of teles to try but so far, the winners for me in v1 have included the cheap and cheerful Pinnacle (nos) PCC88 and for V2, the Tungsol ECC803s short plate gold pin, Sovteck 12ax7WA new production and those Russian 6N2p variants that Oli linked to which Alan's mentioned above.
It doesn't much seem to matter which one's I've used in V3 as these have made the least difference.
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Jun 6, 2020 12:41:39 GMT
*Well, for anyone yet to take the plunge, I would encourage you to put away your doubts because for the outlay and effort, I can guarantee that you will not find anything to better the modded BB3 (BB4?) for the money....anywhere, or at twice the price come to that.This is in no small part due to Oli and Alan's willingness to listen to feedback, look seriously at both any concerns raised as well as to potential improvements or room for improvement areas, then to properly investigate and action those points. Oli has project managed this like a true champ and Alan has been out of the starting blocks so quickly on occasion that a re-start has been ordered by the umpire! People who know me, know that I am honest and tell things as they are. I don't embroider performance when it comes to hifi as my own job and past profession was pretty surgical in analysis, detail and getting results through adopting thorough procedures and applying sound design principles. This is what is going on here. There are step improvements and I think that Oli is being too modest in parts. The latest very rapid progression with E&I traffos, multi-fet boards, and Alan's cleaver little soft stop device have, with a good dollop of valve rolling too, resulted in significant steps forwards. May I drop in a suggestion which will also help people? How about we draft a list of valves known to work well with V1, V2 and V3? **I've had literally dozens of phonotstages through here from modest little Gram Amp 1's through to ££££'s worth of kit. This BB3(4!) sits proudly in the middle, and that's no mean feat.Anyone handy to me who is too far away from Oli or others with one of these is welcome to come and listen to mine when lockdown ends. It won't take much convincing for you to take the leap of faith as hearing is believing. Firstly, thank you for your words Paul. I really appreciate your comments. Have i been a bit too modest? Possibly, but i am really very reluctant to "oversell and underachieve" so my hopes have been that when the builders and buyers of these phonostages get a minute, they would do it for me by sharing their experiences. It's not been as forthcoming as i would have hoped but then, it's no surprise as not everyone feels comfortable nailing their colours to a mast. a couple of * as you may see. * ** I would love to hear what you think when the MultiFET boards go in and your Telefunkens arrive, especially on the MC side. It's been a big step forward but i know you mainly use the BB3 for the MM side. I am hoping to start assembling them next week some time, if the boards arrive. When this Lockdown is over, i am going to visit and bring my BB3 with me, mabe even get ALan to bring his newly modded Paradise with him too. |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 6, 2020 14:35:33 GMT
You're both welcome to do just that. I'm sure we can sort something out. For the moment you can barely swing a cat in the room due to an all active set up, a pair of Cheviots part way through resto, another pair due in on Monday, a pair of Impulse H2s awaiting transformation and a pair of the RFC Canterburys! I'll need to clear some of that lot first.
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Jun 6, 2020 15:25:36 GMT
You're both welcome to do just that. I'm sure we can sort something out. For the moment you can barely swing a cat in the room due to an all active set up, a pair of Cheviots part way through resto, another pair due in on Monday, a pair of Impulse H2s awaiting transformation and a pair of the RFC Canterburys! I'll need to clear some of that lot first. No rush, and I will await an invite as and when you have space, or we'll ditch Alan instead Hahahaha only Kidding Al, we can wait. |
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Post by firebottle on Jun 6, 2020 16:07:47 GMT
Need some space for even bringing down my 'mini' Paradise  |
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Jun 7, 2020 14:45:57 GMT
Matched 100 BF861B in preparation of the MultiFET boards arriving this week. What a ball ache lol Loads of matches though, so I am really pleased.  |
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Post by electronumpty on Jun 7, 2020 18:10:00 GMT
Excellent!
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Post by sq225917 on Jun 7, 2020 20:53:21 GMT
I have 2000 327 and 337 waiting for batching, I feel your pain.
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Jun 7, 2020 23:56:21 GMT
I have 2000 327 and 337 waiting for batching, I feel your pain. That's a grim thought....good luck! |
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Post by sq225917 on Jun 8, 2020 12:39:48 GMT
I have nothing but time
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Jun 8, 2020 13:06:43 GMT
First pair done.... Only 28 more pairs to do.....who's stupid idea was this?  |
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Post by electronumpty on Jun 8, 2020 15:30:04 GMT
How's yer squint?
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Jun 8, 2020 16:18:36 GMT
Far better than my bank balance after realising I've completely miscalculated how many JFETs I'd need! I really need to learn how to count lol |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 8, 2020 18:33:04 GMT
First pair done.... Only 28 more pairs to do.....who's stupid idea was this? I won't answer that on the grounds that it might incriminate me m'laud. |
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Jun 8, 2020 18:33:47 GMT
First pair done.... Only 28 more pairs to do.....who's stupid idea was this? I won't answer that on the grounds that it might incriminate me m'laud. Lol.....o think we all know anyway lol |
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Post by jimbo on Jun 10, 2020 17:26:33 GMT
Maybe one of these on top of the BB3 will bring a little more focus/clarity...?
Or I suppose you could use a nice lump of metal if you have one lying around?
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Jun 10, 2020 17:28:43 GMT
Maybe one of these on top of the BB3 will bring a little more focus/clarity...?
Or I suppose you could use a nice lump of metal if you have one lying around?
Are you trying to start a riot lol I've heard of these and reports are that it's audible when in the system but who knows for sure. |
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Post by jimbo on Jun 10, 2020 17:32:57 GMT
You know me I have an open ear and open mind and a sense of humour. But seriously like everything, you never know until you try it. They are not new as you are probably aware but there maybe some wierd science to back them up.
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Jun 10, 2020 17:38:03 GMT
You know me I have an open ear and open mind and a sense of humour. But seriously like everything, you never know until you try it. They are not new as you are probably aware but there maybe some wierd science to back them up. Yes, I am happy to be an ear qualified listener. I'd like to try one |
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Post by firebottle on Jun 10, 2020 17:51:28 GMT
Before you buy one of those, which are stated to be steel laminations, just try an old EI transformer placed wherever is recommended.
I have an redundant EI output transformer if you want to try it, goes for you James as well.
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Post by jimbo on Jun 10, 2020 17:58:51 GMT
Before you buy one of those, which are stated to be steel laminations, just try an old EI transformer placed wherever is recommended. I have an redundant EI output transformer if you want to try it, goes for you James as well. I think there used o me something called a Fluxdumper sold by Hifi news that did the same job. |
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Jun 10, 2020 22:29:04 GMT
Before you buy one of those, which are stated to be steel laminations, just try an old EI transformer placed wherever is recommended. I have an redundant EI output transformer if you want to try it, goes for you James as well. What!? That does the same thing? |
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Post by firebottle on Jun 11, 2020 6:39:01 GMT
Why not? They are both steel laminations.
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Post by jimbo on Jun 11, 2020 7:13:43 GMT
Does it have to be laminated steel or would a solid lump work?
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Jun 11, 2020 15:32:35 GMT
Upgrade time! 50hrs on the burn in for the caps and now they are in! Awesome.  |
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Post by electronumpty on Jun 11, 2020 15:51:32 GMT
bid red ones!
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