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Post by Deleted on Nov 23, 2019 20:10:58 GMT
I have done some comparative measurements of the 3 speaker leads I have used with my 57's. First off some standard 2.5 mm sq figure 8 that's buried in the wall. Resistance 7.2 milliohm per meter. Capacitance 107p/meter. Second the 2.5 mm sq OCC cable. Resistance 7.8 milliohm per meter. Capacitance 55p/meter. Third the new Dream 2.63 mm sq OCC cable. Resistance 8.3 milliohm per meter. Capacitance 40p/meter. Capacitance is conductor to conductor. All measurements done at 1KHz. Make of them what you will. So the Dream stuff is only 40p per metre, whilst the standard stuff costs 107p per metre. Obvs the Dream is better vfm. |
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Nov 23, 2019 20:27:21 GMT
I have done some comparative measurements of the 3 speaker leads I have used with my 57's. First off some standard 2.5 mm sq figure 8 that's buried in the wall. Resistance 7.2 milliohm per meter. Capacitance 107p/meter. Second the 2.5 mm sq OCC cable. Resistance 7.8 milliohm per meter. Capacitance 55p/meter. Third the new Dream 2.63 mm sq OCC cable. Resistance 8.3 milliohm per meter. Capacitance 40p/meter. Capacitance is conductor to conductor. All measurements done at 1KHz. Make of them what you will. So the Dream stuff is only 40p per metre, whilst the standard stuff costs 107p per metre. Obvs the Dream is better vfm. Och, if only!!!! |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 24, 2019 8:03:28 GMT
I have done some comparative measurements of the 3 speaker leads I have used with my 57's. First off some standard 2.5 mm sq figure 8 that's buried in the wall. Resistance 7.2 milliohm per meter. Capacitance 107p/meter. Second the 2.5 mm sq OCC cable. Resistance 7.8 milliohm per meter. Capacitance 55p/meter. Third the new Dream 2.63 mm sq OCC cable. Resistance 8.3 milliohm per meter. Capacitance 40p/meter. Capacitance is conductor to conductor. All measurements done at 1KHz. Make of them what you will. I make of them nowt, it's only measurements, they don't tell me which one would sound best in any given system ? |
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Nov 24, 2019 8:18:46 GMT
I have done some comparative measurements of the 3 speaker leads I have used with my 57's. First off some standard 2.5 mm sq figure 8 that's buried in the wall. Resistance 7.2 milliohm per meter. Capacitance 107p/meter. Second the 2.5 mm sq OCC cable. Resistance 7.8 milliohm per meter. Capacitance 55p/meter. Third the new Dream 2.63 mm sq OCC cable. Resistance 8.3 milliohm per meter. Capacitance 40p/meter. Capacitance is conductor to conductor. All measurements done at 1KHz. Make of them what you will. I make of them nowt, it's only measurements, they don't tell me which one would sound best in any given system ? No, it won't tell you how your system but they are interesting from a pov that the Better the cable, the less capacitance there is. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 24, 2019 8:20:23 GMT
I have done some comparative measurements of the 3 speaker leads I have used with my 57's. First off some standard 2.5 mm sq figure 8 that's buried in the wall. Resistance 7.2 milliohm per meter. Capacitance 107p/meter. Second the 2.5 mm sq OCC cable. Resistance 7.8 milliohm per meter. Capacitance 55p/meter. Third the new Dream 2.63 mm sq OCC cable. Resistance 8.3 milliohm per meter. Capacitance 40p/meter. Capacitance is conductor to conductor. All measurements done at 1KHz. Make of them what you will. I make of them nowt, it's only measurements, they don't tell me which one would sound best in any given system ? It's only a matter of time before we find somebody who likes QED SA. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 24, 2019 9:19:39 GMT
I have done some comparative measurements of the 3 speaker leads I have used with my 57's. First off some standard 2.5 mm sq figure 8 that's buried in the wall. Resistance 7.2 milliohm per meter. Capacitance 107p/meter. Second the 2.5 mm sq OCC cable. Resistance 7.8 milliohm per meter. Capacitance 55p/meter. Third the new Dream 2.63 mm sq OCC cable. Resistance 8.3 milliohm per meter. Capacitance 40p/meter. Capacitance is conductor to conductor. All measurements done at 1KHz. Make of them what you will. The capacitance seems really low. It’s usually only spaced conductor cables of greater thickness which will get that low, hence the Linn/Naim/Exposure designs. Can I ask is that for a finished cable with positive and negative pressed together in the braid, or is that just the raw wire? |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 24, 2019 9:25:39 GMT
Have you noticed how 'solid core' is being mixed up with 'single core' these days? All wire is solid core. Stranded wire is multiple solid cores. If somebody means a single (thick?) solid core, they should say so.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 24, 2019 9:32:59 GMT
And if you want to talk about Hardcore....
I'm ya man ! 🤪👊
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Post by Deleted on Nov 24, 2019 9:36:21 GMT
Sensible replies only thanks. It is Sunday you know.  |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 24, 2019 9:43:59 GMT
I know. And as a lay preacher I'll be off in an hour to look after my congregation. With the assistance of my new helper at this busy time.. Sister Porschia , releaver of the frustrated. Lovely girl. .  free photos upload website |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 24, 2019 9:58:19 GMT
You want to ask the bishop if there's any funny stuff going on with those choirboys he keeps sneaking into his quarters.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 24, 2019 10:28:59 GMT
[quote author=" Bigman80 " source="/post/31998/thread" timestamp="1574583526"......that the Better the cable, the less capacitance there is. [/quote] Blue Jeans LC-1 is 40pf a metre and you can get a 4m stereo pair for about £60, add postage etc but still way under £100. Chop the ends off, add connectors of choice. voila low capacitance speaker cables if that's the way we need to go??? Is it an option as I have a 10m subwoofer cable that I don't use any longer.....? |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 24, 2019 10:43:54 GMT
Isn’t the LC-1 quite a small diameter cable?
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Post by firebottle on Nov 24, 2019 10:49:13 GMT
I have done some comparative measurements of the 3 speaker leads I have used with my 57's. First off some standard 2.5 mm sq figure 8 that's buried in the wall. Resistance 7.2 milliohm per meter. Capacitance 107p/meter. Second the 2.5 mm sq OCC cable. Resistance 7.8 milliohm per meter. Capacitance 55p/meter. Third the new Dream 2.63 mm sq OCC cable. Resistance 8.3 milliohm per meter. Capacitance 40p/meter. Capacitance is conductor to conductor. All measurements done at 1KHz. Make of them what you will. The capacitance seems really low. It’s usually only spaced conductor cables of greater thickness which will get that low, hence the Linn/Naim/Exposure designs. Can I ask is that for a finished cable with positive and negative pressed together in the braid, or is that just the raw wire? Yes it's positive and negative pressed together in the braid. The individual core insulation is quite thick, hence the low capacitance. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 24, 2019 10:57:20 GMT
Isn’t the LC-1 quite a small diameter cable? Yep I guess so, 6 or 7 mm overall at a guess but I also thought we were looking at small but perfectly formed too..... |
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Post by dsjr on Nov 24, 2019 11:27:22 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Nov 24, 2019 12:05:20 GMT
The capacitance seems really low. It’s usually only spaced conductor cables of greater thickness which will get that low, hence the Linn/Naim/Exposure designs. Can I ask is that for a finished cable with positive and negative pressed together in the braid, or is that just the raw wire? Yes it's positive and negative pressed together in the braid. The individual core insulation is quite thick, hence the low capacitance. Yes, I’d figured it has to be the space created between conductors by the thickness of the isolation. The cores should be 4-5mm apart even when the cables are touching. I’d still not put the cable in a braid at all, if I was making them. capacitance is already low but why pay for the braid when it can be lower again by letting the wires separate. |
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Nov 24, 2019 12:09:07 GMT
[quote author=" Bigman80 " source="/post/31998/thread" timestamp="1574583526"......that the Better the cable, the less capacitance there is. Blue Jeans LC-1 is 40pf a metre and you can get a 4m stereo pair for about £60, add postage etc but still way under £100. Chop the ends off, add connectors of choice. voila low capacitance speaker cables if that's the way we need to go??? Is it an option as I have a 10m subwoofer cable that I don't use any longer.....? [/quote] Having low capacitance in any cable usually helps with the HF extension in my experience, but you're not going to get the obvious improvements the UPOCC conductors provide over OFC if you aren't using OCC cable. Feel free to butcher what ever cable you have lying around. |
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Nov 24, 2019 12:10:40 GMT
Yes it's positive and negative pressed together in the braid. The individual core insulation is quite thick, hence the low capacitance. Yes, I’d figured it has to be the space created between conductors by the thickness of the isolation. The cores should be 4-5mm apart even when the cables are touching. I’d still not put the cable in a braid at all, if I was making them. capacitance is already low but why pay for the braid when it can be lower again by letting the wires separate. Maybe Alan could measure two separated cores. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 24, 2019 13:24:27 GMT
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Post by dsjr on Nov 24, 2019 14:37:52 GMT
I was looking at speaker cables, sorry.. I've used Bluejeans in the past and found them very quick and efficient, as well as not expensive to make cables up.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 24, 2019 15:05:52 GMT
Yes, I’d figured it has to be the space created between conductors by the thickness of the isolation. The cores should be 4-5mm apart even when the cables are touching. I’d still not put the cable in a braid at all, if I was making them. capacitance is already low but why pay for the braid when it can be lower again by letting the wires separate. Maybe Alan could measure two separated cores. That would be interesting, but I don’t want to mess him about on my count. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 24, 2019 15:12:30 GMT
I'm sure I saw a mention of cryogenic treatment earlier. Does anybody know if a current is passed through copper conductors during cryogenic treatment? I'm just wondering if that's necessary and why if it is.
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Nov 24, 2019 15:15:11 GMT
I'm sure I saw a mention of cryogenic treatment earlier. Does anybody know if a current is passed through copper conductors during cryogenic treatment? I'm just wondering if that's necessary and why if it is. Would they do that? |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 24, 2019 15:29:25 GMT
I'm sure I saw a mention of cryogenic treatment earlier. Does anybody know if a current is passed through copper conductors during cryogenic treatment? I'm just wondering if that's necessary and why if it is. Would they do that? I don't know, that's why I asked. |
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Post by sq225917 on Nov 24, 2019 15:40:11 GMT
You might not have intentionally twisted it but look at the loop above the plugs, lower right. That's a full turn right there. A twisted pair suggests two wires twisted together, yes? That is not how these are made. I accept that entirely, the point others are making is that theres twists in it now. Not enough have any effect though. I think wete getting lost between visual and functional here. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 24, 2019 15:48:09 GMT
Are you sure about there being no effect. Seems like an awful lot of twists in this pic.  |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 24, 2019 18:36:25 GMT
You want to ask the bishop if there's any funny stuff going on with those choirboys he keeps sneaking into his quarters. They're for Prince Andrew. 😙 |
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Nov 24, 2019 18:52:19 GMT
I have no idea why there is such an obsession about how the cables were constructed but as I said, I have tried these cables loose. Not touching and in the configuration I built them. Neither had one iota of effect on the sound. There are multiple ways to make cables and the technique I decided on, does a pretty effective job of mi imalising the cables contact with each otherwhen in a confined space. It was actually a technique IXOS use and as I am a fan of what they tried to achieve with their cables, I adopted it here.   As you can see from the picture, I have made a mock up, similar to how the Dream were constructed. A non conductive "rope" is the third winding and it does a good job of separating the conductors for about 2" at a time in this instance. The spacing on The Dream are further apart than this. As has been said, the cables are very thick and actually provide more than enough isolation from each other as it is. Measurments on this cable prove this to be true. This technique gives a better aesthetic and does so with hindering the cables performance in any way. If anyone doubts this, try it for yourself, the wi ding is very effective. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 24, 2019 18:57:16 GMT
I've tried all the reef knots , twists , slipknot spirals and freeform impro jazz versions of cable management.
The version that works the best is without a doubt the one which makes your cables look the most impressive. Because sound wise it's pure snakeoil now stop being silly or I'll ban you. 🤨
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