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Post by Deleted on Sept 14, 2019 19:58:26 GMT
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Post by alit on Sept 14, 2019 20:06:35 GMT
Ali, you've obviously never read my numerous posts regarding NAS decks or my waxing so lyrically about the Mentor plus Decca Microscanner I once owned and loved. I had a high speed Revox B77 IEC and tapes with which to compare. My current Dual 701 is acceptable as is a mid level Rega, but obviously doesn't set the world alight with it's more 'compact' sound presentation. I have, but that wasn’t clear in your post. Agree NA decks are superb. |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 14, 2019 21:54:21 GMT
Quite a few Decks used Matsushita motors. 70's Rotel, Monitor Audio etc. There is a motor of immense quality that no one seems to know about. It was inside a Dual TT and was the basis of the quartz locked Sony motor that went into the TTS8000. Funnily enough, I know a guy who is working on transplanting that motor into a more suitable plinth and also adding quartz lock. It may be a masterstroke. It may not, we will see. |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 14, 2019 22:03:57 GMT
I think the Achilles heel of most the 80's brit turntables were the Airpax
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Post by dsjr on Sept 15, 2019 9:45:38 GMT
My Dual 701 has the original version of that motor and it's very good with no servo overshoot and a totally unworn bearing after all these years when I checked it out not long ago - EDS1000. Technics now use similar tech in their current 1200 models looking at their blurb. personal experience would warn against the old Dual motors as dry joints and knackered caps (tants as well as electrolytics) are rearing their heads
The Airpax motor is fine if treated right. Linn had the Lingo which kept some cogging but the crude but effective Naim Armageddon supply smoothed it right down. I dare say this motor was very cheap back then, if less so now. 12V types now seem to be the rule.
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Post by macca on Sept 15, 2019 10:28:36 GMT
I'd have thought the vagaries of rotating a platter via a rubber band would outweigh any minor issues the motor would introduce. I mean it is a very crude way of doing it even if it does work well enough in practice.
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Post by dsjr on Sept 15, 2019 12:00:01 GMT
The original direct drives were regulated spring-wound clockwork platters and these were still common in the 1940's. Garrard did a governed mains direct drive I think in the late 40's (sketchy memories and I need to get the Garrard history book out to confirm - the 201?) This was probably fine for 78rpm but idlers took over for 33 and 45 spinners as the gearing change was easier i think. probably cheaper too as one simpl,e induction motor could be used. Dual and one or two US models had multiple idlers to change the speeds but they didn't last long.
I may be completely wrong but wasn't it the Vilchur AR deck that started the belt drive plus sub-chassis craze? With sub 2g tracking, the belt and platter mass could be optimised for minimal low rate wow and as tracking forces fell to 1g, dynamic wow under varying stylus load was never a problem and a proper sub chassis isolated the rotating parts very well. My TD125 was superb for this and with a new belt, pitch was too (Thorens decks based on the 150/125 need belts replacing every 500 hours I'd suggest as they stretched quickly in my experience.
Direct drives sort of came in via a few routes in 1970 or so and this may tie in with early IC's and silicon transistors (I think my Dual has germanium types but I can't remember now). Wow, flutter and rumble seemed to be the thing, but little was talked of isolation and the fact that feedback has an effect long before the 'howl-round' sets in. I'm still very fond of the original AR deck (surprisingly good tonearm despite agricultural crudeness) and of course the TD150 (mk2 tonearm not bad at all) was blue-printed into the RD11/LP12 we all know and love/hate today. I never heard the LP12's slow rate wow until I directly compared it with a noisier, but totally pitch stable 301, which had been thoroughly serviced. Sadly in a way, once heard, never forgotten and a Thorens 150/160/125 with new belt I'm sure wasn't quite as bad (you may well feel differently here).
And so on and so on - apologies.
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