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Post by Deleted on Apr 4, 2019 19:30:15 GMT
We agreed he would do it in between jobs to keep costs down, and that meant that it would take some time. Plus I've paid nothing upfront at all. So I'm not stressing it. I know but still, he said Christmas. Its now April!! I just haven't got that patience. |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 4, 2019 19:31:22 GMT
DCB1 is back and (so far) working fine. And back to the system sounding superb again. Soak testing it now with Steely Dan: Greatest Hits. The difference between this and the pre-amp section of the XTZ A100D3 is not small! Someone here was saying they just got an XTZ - do yourself a favour and get one of these DCB1s and use the XTZ as a power amp only and be amazed. Good news! Glad it's back. Hopefully you'll have your speaker cables in the next 14 days too. |
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Post by macca on Apr 5, 2019 7:03:39 GMT
We agreed he would do it in between jobs to keep costs down, and that meant that it would take some time. Plus I've paid nothing upfront at all. So I'm not stressing it. I know but still, he said Christmas. Its now April!! I just haven't got that patience. There were no promises made about Xmas.
if I wasn't entirely happy with what I've got now I might be a bit more angsty about it.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 5, 2019 12:27:14 GMT
I know but still, he said Christmas. Its now April!! I just haven't got that patience. There were no promises made about Xmas.
if I wasn't entirely happy with what I've got now I might be a bit more angsty about it.
Oh! Sorry mate, got the wrong end of the stick. |
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Post by macca on Apr 5, 2019 12:38:53 GMT
No problem, think it might have been Marco who mentioned they'd be ready by Christmas, I was sceptical about that myself.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 5, 2019 15:48:34 GMT
No problem, think it might have been Marco who mentioned they'd be ready by Christmas, I was sceptical about that myself. Ah yes. You're right! |
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Post by macca on Apr 6, 2019 7:09:22 GMT
And the fault is back!
if you ask an EE what's the worst type of fault you can have they will say 'an intermittent one.'
Now not sure if it is the DCB1, the Krell, the speakers or the cd player. System worked fine for 4 hours with the XTZ pre. Thursday it worked fine for 4 hours with the DCB1. Last night fine for 3 hours with DCB1 then faulty again.
if the problem doesn't always show up I'm going to have a hell of a time fault-finding it.
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Apr 6, 2019 7:50:30 GMT
Got a fault in my system somewhere, been dogging me for a couple of weeks now. Breakup in the right channel. Sometimes happens after a few minutes but more normally after a couple of hours. Thought it might be dodgy speaker cable connection but swapping the cables for some others revealed it isn't. So suspicion falls on the DCB1 pre amp since that is the newcomer. Have sent it off to be looked at. In meantime need another pre-amp to check it isn't the Krell at fault. So am using the Pre-amp section of an XTZ A100D3 that was on TV duties:  The integrated was only £70 more than the stand-alone power amp and the pre amp section has MM and MC phono stages and a DAC built in. So not an expensive pre-amp but man! Nothing like as good as the DCB1. Perfectly listenable but where has that magical delicacy gone? Where are those three-dimensional bass guitar notes? Just shows the importance of a pre-amp. Might swap out the Spotfire cable for the Klotz MC which I was using to connect up a cd player on the tv system - that sounds pretty good, quite sweet and delicate. That's assuming the fault does not rear its head - which will pretty much mean a faulty Krell! Mucho expensivo! If it is the DCB1 at fault it will cost next to nothing to sort. So far so good but sometimes it can be on 2 hours or more before it starts to cut out. Just quoting the fault as a refresher. Have you definitely ruled out the source? I might be tempted to rotate the bass drivers 180 degrees too, in case it’s very slight rubbing. Could even be a wire touching the bass unit. I’ve had that before with speakers I sold and it produced an intermittent fault. |
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Post by macca on Apr 6, 2019 8:44:45 GMT
I haven't definitely ruled out anything. The speakers are the least suspect, although not impossible that the problem is there it did not show up during about 8 hours of very high volume use at the Penkridge bake-off. The Krell also performed impeccably there. Obviously either or both could have gone bad since but how likely is that compared to the problem being the DCB1 which is a kit built by Steve who was only just learning electronics when he made it?
My friend Carlos who checked it out for me the other day said he re-flowed some potentially dodgy joints and 'cleaned things up a little' but he had no way to soak test it as he does not own a power amp. Also I would not expect him to be running the thing for hours waiting for the fault to emerge. So it is quite possibly still a problem with the DCB1.
I will try a different CD player next just to rule that out. The problem is that the system can play for hours without the problem emerging. Last night was playing some Lisa Stansfield when it started, and just before it started I was marvelling at how good it sounded. Properly resolved 'club bass' with beautifully delicate mid and top. You couldn't want for more.
Nothing's easy is it?
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Post by macca on Apr 6, 2019 8:48:30 GMT
Oh yes, if it was the speakers you would expect the problem to be consistently there, not to cut in suddenly after several hours of being perfect.
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Apr 6, 2019 9:03:33 GMT
I’d actually misread your post above and thought it had appeared with the XTZ as well as the DCB1. I agree it’s the most likely cause, I
Naturally exploring this would be the best option. I have had intermittent rubbing on a driver before and a pair of speakers I sold were said to have an intermittent distortion caused by a wire fouling the back of the cone. It sounded implausible to me but it saved me a refund.
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Post by antonio on Apr 6, 2019 11:33:25 GMT
I know it would be a bloody nuisance, could you use a completely different set-up, (I mean just chucked together) using the DCB 1 as the pre.
Sorry you're having this problem, guess it's just a methodic process to find the culprit. Try not to pull your hair out.
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Post by macca on Apr 6, 2019 11:34:25 GMT
I agree not impossible it is the speakers.
If I could just swap stuff in and out I could narrow it down in minutes, it's having to play the system for hours before it starts (sometimes) that makes it a real pain. I can't relax and enjoy the sounds as I'm just waiting for it to go wrong!
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Post by macca on Apr 6, 2019 11:37:06 GMT
I know it would be a bloody nuisance, could you use a completely different set-up, (I mean just chucked together) using the DCB 1 as the pre. Sorry you're having this problem, guess it's just a methodic process to find the culprit. Try not to pull your hair out. Yes I could do that - use the XTZ power amp, some B&O speakers, a different cd player and the DCB1. It's just a damn pain dragging it all downstairs and hooking it all up. I'm going to have to do it though. |
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Apr 6, 2019 11:59:59 GMT
I know it would be a bloody nuisance, could you use a completely different set-up, (I mean just chucked together) using the DCB 1 as the pre. Sorry you're having this problem, guess it's just a methodic process to find the culprit. Try not to pull your hair out. Yes I could do that - use the XTZ power amp, some B&O speakers, a different cd player and the DCB1. It's just a damn pain dragging it all downstairs and hooking it all up. I'm going to have to do it though. An alternative would be to loan the DCB1 to a mate and see if it plays up in their system. |
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Post by macca on Apr 6, 2019 14:18:53 GMT
I don't know anyone else local using a pre/power.
I'm going about this all wrong. The Krell is the most expensive and most awkward to fix so it's bound to be that isn't it?
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Post by Deleted on Apr 6, 2019 15:23:39 GMT
Speakers: Reverse leads. If fault still on right - it's the speakers. Doubtful.
Amp: Mono input signals with a jumper on the plugs or inside the thingy preamp. If fault still there - it's the amp. Or reverse the leads (easier). Fault still on the right, it's the amp. Fault on the left - it's preamp/cd.
Preamp: Mono the input with a jumper inside or on the cd plugs. If the fault is still there - it's the preamp thingy. Reverse input leads (easier). Fault still on the right, it's the preamp. Fault on the left - it's the cd player.
CD: If the previous attempts (apart from the last one) find nothing - it's the cd player.
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Post by macca on Apr 6, 2019 16:06:27 GMT
Logical thinking, thanks. Still means I might have to wait for ages for the fault to appear though. Will tackle it tomorrow. Right now have to see what my nag manages to do in the Grand National.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 6, 2019 16:14:29 GMT
There's not an easy answer. There never is with intermittent faults.
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Post by macca on Apr 6, 2019 16:20:55 GMT
Falls at the first! Unbelievable.
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Apr 6, 2019 16:27:30 GMT
So it’s the speakers?
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Post by macca on Apr 6, 2019 16:29:57 GMT
No was talking about my horse.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 6, 2019 18:47:51 GMT
Oh no! Its a bad one when it is intermittent so you have my sympathy...
DCB1 can come here for a listen if needed and I'll have a pot in the box you can loan in a week or so.
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Post by macca on Apr 7, 2019 8:58:50 GMT
Thanks but I'll get to the bottom of it.
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Post by macca on Apr 7, 2019 10:07:40 GMT
Okay- I now have the DCB1 running into the power amp section of the XTZ A100D3
The XTZ is running in Class A mode so I can do a little comparison with the Krell while I'm at it.
I know from experience it's a good amp, a cut above, but you can hear right from the first couple of bars of music that it isn't as good as the Krell. But I'll let it warm up a bit and see where we go.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 7, 2019 13:37:06 GMT
Okay- I now have the DCB1 running into the power amp section of the XTZ A100D3 The XTZ is running in Class A mode so I can do a little comparison with the Krell while I'm at it. I know from experience it's a good amp, a cut above, but you can hear right from the first couple of bars of music that it isn't as good as the Krell. But I'll let it warm up a bit and see where we go. Any news? |
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Post by macca on Apr 7, 2019 15:21:04 GMT
No problems after several hours, looks like it must be the Krell.
It's interesting that XTZ pre into Krell was not a good sound at all but DCB1 into XTZ power amp is pretty good. There's a slight veil compared to the Krell, transients get a bit smeared but I did sort of acclimatise to that after a bit and not worry about it. There's still a pleasant sweetness to the sound.
XTZ into Krell was not sweet. Not harsh either but not a combo I'd bother putting together again. Makes you wonder what pre-amps those people who do not have a high opinion of Krell heard them with.
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Apr 7, 2019 15:47:56 GMT
No problems after several hours, looks like it must be the Krell. It's interesting that XTZ pre into Krell was not a good sound at all but DCB1 into XTZ power amp is pretty good. There's a slight veil compared to the Krell, transients get a bit smeared but I did sort of acclimatise to that after a bit and not worry about it. There's still a pleasant sweetness to the sound. XTZ into Krell was not sweet. Not harsh either but not a combo I'd bother putting together again. Makes you wonder what pre-amps those people who do not have a high opinion of Krell heard them with. It doesn’t surprise me. I tried a few preamps with the Krell I had anencephaly theynvaroed widely. My mate also had that XTZ and tells me the preamp isn’t up to much, but the power amp is very good. Your experience would seem to match his. |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 7, 2019 16:39:12 GMT
Ah! But is it!?!
Who knows what one more minute might have brought?...
Sorry. Couldn't resist it.
Could have saved yourself the humping around.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 7, 2019 19:18:18 GMT
No problems after several hours, looks like it must be the Krell. It's interesting that XTZ pre into Krell was not a good sound at all but DCB1 into XTZ power amp is pretty good. There's a slight veil compared to the Krell, transients get a bit smeared but I did sort of acclimatise to that after a bit and not worry about it. There's still a pleasant sweetness to the sound. XTZ into Krell was not sweet. Not harsh either but not a combo I'd bother putting together again. Makes you wonder what pre-amps those people who do not have a high opinion of Krell heard them with. The DCB1 is a star performer. I think those of us who own one will attest to that. Not surprised its good with the XTZ as it is a good sound with the Burson Bang. Good stuff! Shame about the Krell but, it may not be a bad thing. Give the Krell a service and and you should be good for 10 years. |
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