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Post by karma67 on Oct 11, 2020 10:16:48 GMT
Hope you had a great birthday. 40 eh? Sheesh, I'm old enough to easily be yer Dad! Scary that, but don't know to whom more  ... Hahahaha... Ye twas a good day, thank you. I'd imagine most Audiophiles are old enough to be my dad in all honesty lol thankfully not me lol |
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Post by stevew on Oct 11, 2020 10:25:20 GMT
Hope you had a great birthday. 40 eh? Sheesh, I'm old enough to easily be yer Dad! Scary that, but don't know to whom more ... Hahahaha... Ye twas a good day, thank you. I'd imagine most Audiophiles are old enough to be my dad in all honesty lol We need your hearing mate. Most of ours are f*****d. Lol |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 11, 2020 10:27:21 GMT
Hahahaha... Ye twas a good day, thank you. I'd imagine most Audiophiles are old enough to be my dad in all honesty lol thankfully not me lol Nor me... |
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Oct 11, 2020 10:32:50 GMT
Hahahaha... Ye twas a good day, thank you. I'd imagine most Audiophiles are old enough to be my dad in all honesty lol We need your hearing mate. Most of ours are f*****d. Lol Hahaha... Mine is bound to be deteriorating..should get it checked out. |
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Oct 11, 2020 10:33:44 GMT
Hahahaha... Ye twas a good day, thank you. I'd imagine most Audiophiles are old enough to be my dad in all honesty lol thankfully not me lol Lol.... |
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Post by dsjr on Oct 11, 2020 11:04:20 GMT
You're very young for all this nonsense I must say  |
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Oct 11, 2020 11:11:56 GMT
You're very young for all this nonsense I must say I suppose so, but there are a few of us younger (relative term) guys who are very enthusiastic about vinyl and HiFi in general. Its no bad thing....but it's harder to get any respect from the older guys who have "time served"..... No different to anywhere else really. One day I'll have a bit of seniority and i expect I'll be exactly the same lol Life! |
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Post by jimbo on Oct 11, 2020 11:36:10 GMT
You're very young for all this nonsense I must say You will probably have started even younger!? |
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Post by nuff on Oct 11, 2020 11:38:10 GMT
I’m a little late to the party but wishing you a Happy Birthday Oli, Hope your day was a good 1. 🎁 🎂 🎈
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Post by misterc on Oct 11, 2020 11:42:48 GMT
Pretty sure Oli is not sitting in his comfy slippers sipping Horlicks, zoning out to Sun Ra with his Harbeth's and Sugden's mellowing away his life  He's got a few years left in him yet  |
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Oct 11, 2020 11:50:16 GMT
Pretty sure Oli is not sitting in his comfy slippers sipping Horlicks, zoning out to Sun Ra with his Harbeth's and Sugden's mellowing away his life He's got a few years left in him yet Hahaha, no Harbeths here mate. Drinking Pepsi Max, eating a Mint Aero cupcake and listening to Thin Lizzy - Live and Dangerous. Rock and roll 🤣 |
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Oct 11, 2020 11:50:24 GMT
I’m a little late to the party but wishing you a Happy Birthday Oli, Hope your day was a good 1. 🎁 🎂 🎈 Cheers matey! |
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Post by sq225917 on Oct 11, 2020 14:08:55 GMT
Mint Aero, food of the gods.
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Post by gninnam on Oct 11, 2020 14:40:09 GMT
Hope you had a great birthday. 40 eh? Sheesh, I'm old enough to easily be yer Dad! Scary that, but don't know to whom more ... Same here - old enough (just) to be his dad but I am sure I ain't  |
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Post by dsjr on Oct 11, 2020 14:46:49 GMT
You're very young for all this nonsense I must say You will probably have started even younger!? I started as a toddler in the late 50's! - began buying Hi Fi Sound magazine (very objective tests) in 1967 (sadly, they suffered in my parents' loft and were chucked out twenty odd years ago - I should have tried to save them as so many reviews of now sought after classic stuff including a turntable group test; 401, TD124, G99 and the winning Sony TTS3000 - and started as a Saturday boy in 1973.
I apologise for the way I am, but it's kinda scary for me to see Oli doing and discovering today much of what I was doing and discovering forty years ago - the first time around. Hope you lot can make allowances for this old sourpuss sticking his oar in from time to time.
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Post by misterc on Oct 11, 2020 17:15:05 GMT
Dave Thorough I would like to add life and technology have moved on quite substantially especially in the last ten years and I suspect what Oli listening to currently is somewhat detached from the SQ you were listening back in the early 70's even at a pro rata rate I grew up around very respectable recording studio's in that period and most of the hifi that was sold then was pretty phish yes 57's and early Jap receivers were fine for those days and the nostalgic guys, but in reality most guys were listening to either the unholy trinity, in which case 57's aint gunna cut the mustard or musical masturbation on grand scale via Miles Davies and the avant garde jazz brigade. Until Mr Verker and his 'Exceeding good amplifiers'  and uncle Ivor and his knock off Ari stone deck rolled up and fooled all the would be nouveau riche in those days and the south west's contingent of 'are you on the square brother'  self important dodgy handshake squad. Oh have times have changed thankfully for the better Certainly not an age thing here, plenty of the chaps I deal with are over 70 and enjoy real music pretty regularly without resorting to either having the ears syringed or mogadon injected into their eyeballs, so no need to fire up the comfy slippers and join around the circle of old ladies with hot sweet tea. These boys do not suffer from COCS either (Crusty Old Codger Syndrome) Carry on being Oli as life's to short to waste away worrying if my lp12 looks good in matt black or my nait2/Kan's sounds better than anything you have ever heard at a hifi shop or an Audio T on a wet and windy Saturday morning in Rhyl during a particularly damp January |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 11, 2020 20:41:24 GMT
37 here.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 11, 2020 20:41:42 GMT
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Post by iceman16 on Oct 11, 2020 21:08:33 GMT
Belated Happy Birthday Oliver!  |
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Oct 11, 2020 21:25:22 GMT
Belated Happy Birthday Oliver! Hahahaha thats brilliant. Thanks, Jayson. |
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Post by dsjr on Oct 12, 2020 9:29:54 GMT
Dave Thorough I would like to add life and technology have moved on quite substantially especially in the last ten years and I suspect what Oli listening to currently is somewhat detached from the SQ you were listening back in the early 70's even at a pro rata rate I grew up around very respectable recording studio's in that period and most of the hifi that was sold then was pretty phish yes 57's and early Jap receivers were fine for those days and the nostalgic guys, but in reality most guys were listening to either the unholy trinity, in which case 57's aint gunna cut the mustard or musical masturbation on grand scale via Miles Davies and the avant garde jazz brigade. Until Mr Verker and his 'Exceeding good amplifiers' and uncle Ivor and his knock off Ari stone deck rolled up and fooled all the would be nouveau riche in those days and the south west's contingent of 'are you on the square brother' self important dodgy handshake squad. Oh have times have changed thankfully for the better Certainly not an age thing here, plenty of the chaps I deal with are over 70 and enjoy real music pretty regularly with resorting to either having the ears syringed or mogadon injected into their balls, so no need to fire up the comfy slippers and join around the circle of old ladies with hot sweet tea. These boys do not suffer from COCS either (Crusty Old Codger Syndrome) Carry on being Oli as life's to short to waste away worrying if my lp12 looks good in matt black or my nait2/Kan's sounds better than anything you have ever heard at a hifi shop or an Audio T on a wet and windy Saturday morning in Rhyl during a particularly damp Januray
I came into the industry proper in 1974 at the very top - Crown DC300A and big IMF's, which I reckon could still cut it today. Bc1's sounded small and constricted in our large dem room, but really rather delightful in a smaller sitting room I later discovered. We sold BIG speakers (Tannoys were regarded as very coloured in tone even then and this before the Cheviot/Arden HPD era which were worse if anything, although heard on their own you didn't notice it). Can's 'Halleluwah!' played via the dominating Crown hybrid Electrostatics skulking in the corners was a revelation, the whole building used to throb on the rhythm I loved the AR LST's too but these are unfashionably large today sadly.
I've always liked good big speakers and feel Kans especially lost half the music as they had no bass and distorted if pushed down there, the rest too shrill for me to enjoy (and I heard and sold dozens of pairs to the party faithful). Isobariks for me back then in the esrly to mid 80's before KEFD ruined the mid drivers. Naim's bolt-up 250 and baby 120 sounded totally opposite to the 110 and 250 BC era and this started a suspicion in my with was solved when the Quad-like Linn amps first appeared (maybe Quad had it more 'right' all along with e 44/405-2 anyway back then). JV didn't like me at all for a good few years after I can tell you.
I use Crown amps to this day and a DC300A is on th ebucket list. It's not the beast it once was and is at least equalled by a Quad 606 which some of you would bypass 'cos it's *only* a boring old Quad, but I love the thing regardless and like the sound of music amplified through it
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Post by misterc on Oct 12, 2020 11:35:41 GMT
Hello Dave I shall refrain from discussing Tannoy's as firewood is too good for them Crown like a poor man's krell' only less appealing imho and Isobariks and 6 packs really? LOL, next you will be telling me DBL were the pinnacle of audio reproduction  Totally agree on the Kan's though, Seriously audio is so subjective one man's meat etc, I genuinely never felt that so called hifi really produced any commercially available reproductive qualities that even got close to reasonable approximation to studio monitoring until the late 90's. Then it starting getting listenable imho Granted the vast majority of listeners would not wish to a studio environment sound (though many think they do!) it is just for monitoring and mixing purposes and at home its not realist proposition for the great number of audiophiles. Remind me to tell you the story of a very well know audio store's 'Sales prevention officer' when I have more time it's quite amusing |
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Post by pauld on Oct 12, 2020 12:00:22 GMT
Is that Sale Prevention Officer the very one from Berkshire by any chance Tony?
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Post by Deleted on Oct 12, 2020 12:01:47 GMT
Hello Dave I shall refrain from discussing Tannoy's as firewood is too good for them Crown like a poor man's krell' only less appealing imho and Isobariks and 6 packs really? LOL, next you will be telling me DBL were the pinnacle of audio reproduction Totally agree on the Kan's though, Seriously audio is so subjective one man's meat etc, I genuinely never felt that so called hifi really produced any commercially available reproductive qualities that even got close to reasonable approximation to studio monitoring until the late 90's. Then it starting getting listenable imho Granted the vast majority of listeners would not wish to a studio environment sound (though many think they do!) it is just for monitoring and mixing purposes and at home its not realist proposition for the great number of audiophiles. Remind me to tell you the story of a very well know audio store's 'Sales prevention officer' when I have more time it's quite amusing How would you say a cd reflects the sound of a mastertape? |
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Post by misterc on Oct 12, 2020 12:17:30 GMT
Well Bruce
CD can sound pretty decent these days, *caveat* (in the same way time was taken in the in original recording and transfer to said ploy carbonate medium as it is will the more specialized vinyl) but it wasn't until the late 90's Wadia's that three dimensionality and textural rendering began to surface for the masses.
They are some rather special CD's as there are quality vinyl in the same way there are truly awful black pizza's and shiny Frisbee's
The sound of ANY playback medium is totally dominated by the mastering and transfer process no question.
I personally stopped listening to CD's some 10 years ago, that doesn't mean to say they are not decsent at all, I just prefer FBA I feel it is big leap above anything currently available without being anal about replay.
We do have a Studer master tape units available an A820 which I have refreshed and it sounds stunning, but so does our Pro tools CORRECTLY setup recording suite as well.
Which would you prefer?, they are both superb is a question of how you like your coffee nothing more
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Post by misterc on Oct 12, 2020 12:28:40 GMT
Is that Sale Prevention Officer the very one from Berkshire by any chance Tony? Hi Paul You read my mind how spooky? This chap is quite something, upon entering the shop he pounced while I was looking at the information tickets on the products and asked what equipment I was listening to 'Wadia and Wilsons' I replied, his face contorted and his brow furrowed, then came the reposte 'They crap sir, you really need Naim, nothing better absolutely the best available sir' I asked why? He proclaimed Naim ARE audio in the world not just the UK, then dragged me into the demo room for an education in audio replay  Nap 500/CD3/XPS cd player/552 and SL2's after 40 minutes of prime attempted indoctrination in to the cult of naim I wasn't prepared for my senses to be assaulted and battered into submission by this what can only be described as a wall of sound that would make Phil Spector wince. Holy cow it was intense and overwhelming in the most diplomatic sense or just plain shite in the real world. I have never come across a salesman so convicted in his beliefs as this guy he was almost like JV had programmed him from birth to be the perfect naim audio assassin, I needed a stiff beer after that 'experience' But this guy was so enthusiastic about naim I didn't even get tune dem'd just an all out assault on the ear drums it still leaves me scarred to this day and it was truly grim but you had to admire the guys balls |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 12, 2020 21:33:43 GMT
Well Bruce CD can sound pretty decent these days, *caveat* (in the same way time was taken in the in original recording and transfer to said ploy carbonate medium as it is will the more specialized vinyl) but it wasn't until the late 90's Wadia's that three dimensionality and textural rendering began to surface for the masses. They are some rather special CD's as there are quality vinyl in the same way there are truly awful black pizza's and shiny Frisbee's The sound of ANY playback medium is totally dominated by the mastering and transfer process no question. I personally stopped listening to CD's some 10 years ago, that doesn't mean to say they are not decsent at all, I just prefer FBA I feel it is big leap above anything currently available without being anal about replay. We do have a Studer master tape units available an A820 which I have refreshed and it sounds stunning, but so does our Pro tools CORRECTLY setup recording suite as well. Which would you prefer?, they are both superb is a question of how you like your coffee nothing more FBA? Free Buddist Audio? Fulfilled By Amazon? Gave up looking after that. Have no interest in - Ah!!! Got it!! File Based Audio!! None whatsoever. My cd player isn't the last word in detail retrieval and resolution - but I like it. Read a bit by that Analog Planet bloke, Whatshisname. Michael Fremer? He had a bit of a chat with Ray Davis. The comparison between vinyl and cd came up. With vinyl, the frequency response could be viewed with suspicion. That didn't exist with cd, RD thought, but he thought - what was it? That was it. It was to do with the bass. He thought it didn't sit on anything, or something like that. It didn't have a foundation. My first cd player was a Philips 150. I was expecting Great Things from it. Sadly, they didn't materialize. Not that I had a top-notch turntable; it was a DIY effort. Some years later it was replaced with a Meridian 207. This was better, but what I couldn't get over with a lot of CDs, was the apparent lack of detail. I had the first issue of Jeff Wayne's War of The World's. I listen to it 3 times and gave it away. I couldn't get over the lack of detail compared to the record. Years later I got the SACD version which thankfully I could listen to on the same Meridian player. |
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Post by misterc on Oct 12, 2020 23:00:35 GMT
Well Bruce you have to roll with what you feel works for you if its does, its as simple as that
The bottom line is very easy if you have been listening to vinyl for over 20 years then you will always prefer vinyl no argument.
I am fortunate to have a respectable vinyl front end and its quite acceptable bit not my first choice for replay where for many others it is.
Personally CD was pretty dire until 1994 the early players were thin etched and quite frankly grim and no matter how you cut with delta sigma non over sampling or adding valves to the output stage or two dozen double crown dac chips it was still polishing a turd
Just as a side bar back in 2016 when were demonstrating Tad at the Windsor show we had two systems on display
The reference Tad system had a fully loaded Oracle Delhi MK VI with quality jap cartridge Thales top arm super dooper record cleaner and very desirable Russian phononstage
In one of the Q&A sessions we cued up a jap 200 pressing of the wall set the arm over the record
We actually played a CD, just turned off the display on the player we had many positive comments about the sound being the best vinyl many had listened to in a long time
When we asked the audience to inspect the TT we had some shocked faces, what was even more surprising from the onlookers is that the cpTad cd-player was attached to evolution system not the reference set up.
System construction and performance are inexplicably tied you can have a six figure vinyl system sound average for its price tag conversely you can have a rive figure cdcsupyayptem set up exceptionally well
Having grown up with studio master tapes I had no need for vinyl but understand it's a big part for many audiophiles
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Post by Deleted on Oct 12, 2020 23:57:15 GMT
Well, Top Cat (!), I don't have shedloads of money to spend on hi-fi. And I don't take it seriously anymore. I'm an old man now! I buy what you would call "tat". I've just bought an original Rega 2 turntable as it was pretty cheap (£120) and I've fancied one for a while, just out of curiosity. Needs a counterweight for the arm. Most of the time I buy secondhand CDs or new depending upon what it is. Sometimes, depending on what it is and cost, I'll buy a record. Again, depending upon what it is, I'll buy the record and cd.
A big problem with FBA for me is in sense ethical. The amount an artist gets for their material is so woefully small. It just seems artists are being taken advantage of. And that's down to how record companies have put them up to exploit with the streaming services.
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Oct 13, 2020 6:52:59 GMT
Well, Top Cat (!), I don't have shedloads of money to spend on hi-fi. And I don't take it seriously anymore. I'm an old man now! I buy what you would call "tat". I've just bought an original Rega 2 turntable as it was pretty cheap (£120) and I've fancied one for a while, just out of curiosity. Needs a counterweight for the arm. Most of the time I buy secondhand CDs or new depending upon what it is. Sometimes, depending on what it is and cost, I'll buy a record. Again, depending upon what it is, I'll buy the record and cd. A big problem with FBA for me is in sense ethical. The amount an artist gets for their material is so woefully small. It just seems artists are being taken advantage of. And that's down to how record companies have put them up to exploit with the streaming services. FBA has given artists an outlet. Wheras in the old days you NEEDED a label to release your material, now you can do it all yourself. The reason the big studios are tying bands/artists into horrible deals is that they know the end is nigh! P2P file sharing has decimated the studios grip on material as it has with the movie industry. I am all for FBA and once something comes along (to my house) that demonstrates the ability to dethrone Vinyl in my system, i will adopt it with gusto. Until then, i will continue to buy and listen to "black plastic pizza's" As for Digital versus Tape for recording, Tape would always get my vote. For no other reason than i love the way it sounds. Is it as "all capturing"? probably not. |
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He's got a few years left in him yet 
self important dodgy handshake squad. Oh have times have changed 
