Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Aug 8, 2019 7:48:03 GMT
It’s been a tricky one for me. I used to do quick AB comparisons. Choose the one that sounded the most engaging and then find I had listener fatigue a few days later. Took me a long time not to trust AB comparisons. It also accentuates difference, which I feel misrepresents how we listen
These days if I try something new, I usually live with it and then switch back. If it’s obviously an improvement, I sometimes don’t bother swapping back at all.
You hear of people always blind listening. I’d find that hard to do without significant help. I also don’t think it represents listening conditions so I personally don’t rate it. If the difference is subtle enough for you to have to test blind, I don’t feel it matters what you decide anyway.
You also hear of folk swapping back and forth with cartridges. Unless you have two identical headshells, I’d say this is fraught with problems regarding setup. Even then you have tracking weight and VTF to consider. Again, I’d expect a preference to be obvious otherwise I’d not bother. Does auditory memory last lng enough for such changes? I dunno.
Some things I just take on assumption. I’ve enjoyed leads with Eichmann plugs. I couldn’t be bothered making up identical leads to AB test. I can’t see the point, personally.
All of this is just what I do and how I feel. No claims to being right and no wish to “convert” others. I just thought it was an interesting topic for discussion. Sometimes reading what others do can lead you to the-evaluate your own approach, so I’d genuinely value other people’s thoughts.
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Post by antonio on Aug 8, 2019 8:05:11 GMT
I always do an A-B comparison first, then leave the new item in the system for a few days, revert back to get a better 'feel' for differences made. One item I tried a good few years ago was a Vertex AQ Kinabalu platform, could hear bugger all difference in an A-B comparison but left in the system under a cdp for a few days, removed but soon replaced. Tried the A-B test again but still could not hear a difference.  Sorry this platform got 'lost' when I moved abroad, as I would love to try it again under my cdt. |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 8, 2019 11:31:12 GMT
you need to live with something for a while, try a variety of music, with you in a variety of moods, with and without other people i think. Then swap back if you can and see how that works. I often find I only really notice what I gained when i go back and lose it again (or not). Basically try it 'as normal' for a decent period (couple of weeks if possible) then go back to the original and see whether you miss the new kit or not.
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Post by macca on Aug 8, 2019 14:53:07 GMT
I like to try something for a few weeks, play a lot of different music and try to catch it out. If it survives that then it will probably stay. Sometimes I'll think something is staying then one particular record will catch it out, reveal it's flaw, and then I hear that flaw with everything else I play. Even the stuff I thought sounded fine previously.
Nothing wrong with giving first impressions, or ongoing impressions, but I don't assume that they are final anymore. I see that with other people too. They get something new in and immediately report it is the best thing ever. Then a week or so later they are back 'It's still great overall but it does this thing I don't like...'
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Post by sq225917 on Aug 8, 2019 14:56:36 GMT
If im not 100% sure theres a difference after a few minutes of listening then I'm not interested in the swap. If I do think thetes an obvious difference then I'll do a blind and if it still holds ip a longer line with it for a few days comparison.
I'm not interested in chasing minutiae
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Post by dsjr on Aug 8, 2019 16:59:10 GMT
I could always pretty well 'get' gear differences in a few minutes, any time after this usually confirming the initial impressions. If it takes days or weeks to 'get' the gear in the first place, I'd respectfully suggest it's a needless comparison. I'd also suggest there's music out there than can catch any speaker/amp combo out (I'm assuming modern digital sources are pretty benign - these days).
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Post by macca on Aug 8, 2019 17:13:09 GMT
I probably should have mentioned that if it isn't doing anything for me to begin with I won't go any further with it. I know I'll adapt to the new sound if I leave it in the system but that doesn't mean I'll be satisfied with it.
All this business of 'It sounded crap out of the box and I thought I'd wasted my money but 300 hours later it suddenly came on song!' is a load of bollocks. It's crap and you just eventually got used to its crapness!
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Aug 8, 2019 20:04:24 GMT
I probably should have mentioned that if it isn't doing anything for me to begin with I won't go any further with it. I know I'll adapt to the new sound if I leave it in the system but that doesn't mean I'll be satisfied with it. All this business of 'It sounded crap out of the box and I thought I'd wasted my money but 300 hours later it suddenly came on song!' is a load of bollocks. It's crap and you just eventually got used to its crapness! We really need an applause emoji! You see it so often and I can’t help but feel it’s self justification and nothing more. Wait a few weeks and you see said item getting moved on. |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 8, 2019 20:45:52 GMT
I probably should have mentioned that if it isn't doing anything for me to begin with I won't go any further with it. I know I'll adapt to the new sound if I leave it in the system but that doesn't mean I'll be satisfied with it. All this business of 'It sounded crap out of the box and I thought I'd wasted my money but 300 hours later it suddenly came on song!' is a load of bollocks. It's crap and you just eventually got used to its crapness!I tell people this, but do they listen? |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 8, 2019 21:43:34 GMT
In my experience new hi-fi equipment only needs a couple hours and bingo! F#ck 300 hours.
S.
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Post by macca on Aug 9, 2019 7:37:51 GMT
I've not has anything go from crap to good even in a couple of hours.
Although crap can be system dependant. I bought a brand new Rotel amp one time, cost me over 500 quid and it was Sh#t from the get go and never changed. No bass, shut in top end. Sold it to my neighbour and in his system it sounds good. Not just acceptable but good.
Another of the pitfalls of evaluation is getting the matching right. In that case it just didn't like my speakers at the time, which were a very tricky load. Easy to jump to the wrong conclusions without taking that into account.
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Post by dsjr on Aug 9, 2019 8:28:09 GMT
Apparently our brains adapt to a different sound in around twenty minutes, but I think it's the first few seconds of listening quite often that really tells the truth..
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Aug 9, 2019 13:10:31 GMT
I’m still confused about that. I agree about the brain compensating after a while but if the first few seconds of listening are following from something else, I feel it’s not an accurate assessment because you are evaluating difference rather than intrinsic sound,
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Post by Deleted on Aug 9, 2019 14:47:02 GMT
Apparently our brains adapt to a different sound in around twenty minutes, but I think it's the first few seconds of listening quite often that really tells the truth.. I think the first period of listening is quite misleading, you might not notice stuff that grates, or you might not like a system just because it's different. If a short listen was actually that informative people wouldn't buy completely wrong systems based on demos  My mate's system was so different to mine it used to take me 30 mins or so to settle into it whenever I visited. I didn't dislike it, but it was so different in style (I have Tannoys, he had Amphions) it took that time to dial into his system. |
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Post by dsjr on Aug 9, 2019 16:27:48 GMT
Maybe my career and hundreds of dems I did kind of attuned my ears to 'new sounds' quite quickly, I don't know. I can tell you that most 'customers' who wanted to borrow stuff for many days running into weeks, were 'tyre kickers' to the man (ladies have better things to do with their time that fart around with audio gear, even if they love the music itself) and rarely bought anything - from anywhere, as a few of us dealers local to each other shared notes on who was messing about with borrowing stuff and from whom.. This applied to all the places I worked and not any one in particular.
A now deceased dear friend of mine (who was also a lady by the way), had a full Quad system with '57's. These speakers do have a distinctive character to them in every session I ever had, but again, a couple of minutes to get used to the slightly 'pinched nasal sound' they often have (this actually enhances string tone to be fair) and you just get lost in the music being played as well as the *way* the musical strands are played.
Just my vibe of course.
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Aug 9, 2019 19:10:00 GMT
Yep the “borrowers” never bought stuff. My biggest frustration was folk who went for “shouty” kit. They were always back trying to find ways of keeping the “detail” without the harshness. Usually cables or supports. IMO it wasn’t detail but it’s hard to convince others when they are that way inclined.
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Sorry this platform got 'lost' when I moved abroad, as I would love to try it again under my cdt.
