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Post by ijrussell on Oct 31, 2022 20:05:51 GMT
I visited Oli (Bigman80) in sunny Wolverhampton on Sunday 30th October to listen to his new (to him) Troels Gravesen Ekta floor standing speakers built by Jason (Arke Audio). My hearing is pretty good for a 56-year-old but I don't have the 'golden ears' of the likes of Oli.  Kit List: Technics SP10 turntable Heavily modified AT-1010 tonearm Lyra *Helikon* MC cartridge BigBottle Avalon/BT2 phono stage/preamplifier BigBottle Neurochrome 686 power amplifier Troels Gravesen Ekta floorstanding speakers My Music: David Sylvian - Brilliant Trees (Side A) Porcupine Tree - In Absentia (Side A - Tracks 1 and 2) Talk Talk - The Colour of Spring (Side A - Track 1) Talk Talk - Spirit of Eden (Side B - Tracks 4 and 5) Tears For Fears - The Hurting (Side A) Eurythmics - Sweet Dreams (Side A) Oli played an old blues recording, which I can't remember the name of, that sounded really good. Listening Summary: I was really impressed with the Ektas on the end of Oli's high quality system. The only track that I didn't think matched my memory of the Duos plus sub from last week was Track 3 Nostalgia from David Sylvian which has some sub 30hz bass. Other than that, the Ektas were clean, clear, and dynamic. Clarity was excellent, even at fairly low volumes. Vocals and real instruments sounded as they should. I heard zero chuffing from the front-facing ports. Both The Hurting and Sweet Dreams can sound quite muddled and lifeless on lesser systems but Oli's system made them sound magnificent. It was amazing how much detail was in the Eurythmics recording. I did feel that the speakers were a little rolled off at the top but that turned out to be easy to fix. The effect was quite subtle but noticeable enough, even for an oldie like me! Summary: I could happily live with the Duos and sub but the Ektas were superior to my ears across all of the music that we played, as they should be given the difference in price. Even more to ponder after this session given my self-imposed limit on spending per component which the Ektas exceed. Thanks to Oli for an enjoyable afternoon of listening. |
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Arke
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Post by Arke on Oct 31, 2022 20:31:05 GMT
Great write up, thanks Ian. It sounds like you certainly appreciated what the Ekta mkIIs can do. As you found out, those Ekta mkIIs have 3 treble attenuation settings - it is very useful for fine tuning to your room and tastes. As mentioned before, we can certainly find an option that will give you great performance within your budget. There are a few options which could get very close to the Ektas and maybe provide other advantages. Have a look at these too: www.troelsgravesen.dk/Illuminator-71.html(medium sized standmount with same bass driver as Ekta mkIIs and a VERY good tweeter - Troels has a personal pair of these, so they must be good) www.troelsgravesen.dk/Faital-3WC-10.htm(a very good VFM medium/large standmount. These could be great for you too) Drop me a message if you wish to discuss options any further. |
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Post by stevew on Oct 31, 2022 21:09:47 GMT
Thank you for writing up your experience Ian.
I have a great respect for those with the ability to write down and express what they hear.
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Oct 31, 2022 22:01:58 GMT
Hi ijrussell You didn't seem to have too much wrong with the lug holes when you picked up the HF roll off! I think you're underselling your hearing a little. And yes, I'm a cheeky git, but in my defense not all 56yr olds hear HF as well as the younger guys!!!! Anyway, Thank you for the kind words. I am glad you enjoyed the system. The HF roll off was the same HF roll off I described after my visit to Jasons. I couldn't pin point what was causing it at Jason's, thinking at one point it could be the OCC cables, but after a few days of having them here it became clear that it was the speaker themselves. When Jason built them he used the Troels XO design which incorporates three HF settings. One is "Flat" one is "Scandinavian Tuning" (I have dubbed it) and one is rolled off further still. The Scandinavian Tuning is how they were set when I received them, but quickly realised that the Flat tuning was how to get the best from them in my room. The rockwool panels causing the Troels tuning to sound more rolled off due to the reduction of reflection points around the speakers. However, for the purpose of Ian's visit, I rolled them back to the Troels setting. Fair play to Ian, he spotted the roll off and after a few minutes of pissing about behind the speakers, we were set back up at "Flat" For me, this is where the diction in vocals starts to really show up. In Troels mode, the Terry Evans LP sounds like he has a slight speech impediment...like he's mumbling. In Flat mode, the diction improves and the vocals clean right up and it's clarity personified. The rest of the session was set like that and yes, Terry Evans sounded utterly sublime, I have to agree. I enjoyed the session. It's always nice to hear new to me music. |
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Post by stevew on Oct 31, 2022 22:10:24 GMT
Really interesting to read that there is 3 options for HF available.. I wasn’t aware of this.
Funnily enough I was playing around with cables tonight, and between the bb3 and the pre I changed my Linn silvers for triple c’s.
Much more clarity and separation but ouch.. a tad harsh. That option to flatten out the hf would be interesting to play with.
By the way I remember buying that Eurythmics album after seeing them live in Oxford. Clem Burke (ex of Blondie drummer) was playing for them … amazing
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Oct 31, 2022 22:41:24 GMT
Really interesting to read that there is 3 options for HF available.. I wasn’t aware of this. Funnily enough I was playing around with cables tonight, and between the bb3 and the pre I changed my Linn silvers for triple c’s. Much more clarity and separation but ouch.. a tad harsh. That option to flatten out the hf would be interesting to play with. By the way I remember buying that Eurythmics album after seeing them live in Oxford. Clem Burke (ex of Blondie drummer) was playing for them … amazing Yeah, it's standard apparently, but I'm going to tweak mine a little and have one between the Troels setting and the Flat setting. That's just to experiment, but you may as well if you can. You may have a different cable experience when you get your Etka. |
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Arke
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Post by Arke on Nov 1, 2022 7:05:29 GMT
Really interesting to read that there is 3 options for HF available.. I wasn’t aware of this. Funnily enough I was playing around with cables tonight, and between the bb3 and the pre I changed my Linn silvers for triple c’s. Much more clarity and separation but ouch.. a tad harsh. That option to flatten out the hf would be interesting to play with. By the way I remember buying that Eurythmics album after seeing them live in Oxford. Clem Burke (ex of Blondie drummer) was playing for them … amazing The three tweeter attenuation settings is something I added to the Ektas (now Oli's). It is standard to have 2 or 3 settings on some Troels kits and some have one setting. The (your) Ekta mkII kit has just one option currently. Alan has opted to keep that setting - that's as he heard them at Oli's. I could add options to yours if you wish, I'll message direct to discus. |
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Post by stevew on Nov 1, 2022 7:07:22 GMT
Really interesting to read that there is 3 options for HF available.. I wasn’t aware of this. Funnily enough I was playing around with cables tonight, and between the bb3 and the pre I changed my Linn silvers for triple c’s. Much more clarity and separation but ouch.. a tad harsh. That option to flatten out the hf would be interesting to play with. By the way I remember buying that Eurythmics album after seeing them live in Oxford. Clem Burke (ex of Blondie drummer) was playing for them … amazing The three tweeter attenuation settings is something I added to the Ektas (now Oli's). It is standard to have 2 or 3 settings on some Troels kits and some have one setting. The (your) Ekta mkII kit has just one option currently. Alan has opted to keep that setting - that's as he heard them at Oli's. I could add options to yours if you wish, I'll message direct to discus. Please do Jason, as I wasn’t aware of the option. |
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Bigman80
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AA Founding Member & Bigbottle Audio Creator
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Post by Bigman80 on Nov 1, 2022 7:09:30 GMT
Really interesting to read that there is 3 options for HF available.. I wasn’t aware of this. Funnily enough I was playing around with cables tonight, and between the bb3 and the pre I changed my Linn silvers for triple c’s. Much more clarity and separation but ouch.. a tad harsh. That option to flatten out the hf would be interesting to play with. By the way I remember buying that Eurythmics album after seeing them live in Oxford. Clem Burke (ex of Blondie drummer) was playing for them … amazing The three tweeter attenuation settings is something I added to the Ektas (now Oli's). It is standard to have 2 or 3 settings on some Troels kits and some have one setting. The (your) Ekta mkII kit has just one option currently. Alan has opted to keep that setting - that's as he heard them at Oli's. I could add options to yours if you wish, I'll message direct to discus. Oh, it seems quite common on the build threads so i presumed it was standard. Apologies. |
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Arke
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Post by Arke on Nov 1, 2022 7:25:30 GMT
Hi ijrussell You didn't seem to have too much wrong with the lug holes when you picked up the HF roll off! I think you're underselling your hearing a little. And yes, I'm a cheeky git, but in my defense not all 56yr olds hear HF as well as the younger guys!!!! Anyway, Thank you for the kind words. I am glad you enjoyed the system. The HF roll off was the same HF roll off I described after my visit to Jasons. I couldn't pin point what was causing it at Jason's, thinking at one point it could be the OCC cables, but after a few days of having them here it became clear that it was the speaker themselves. When Jason built them he used the Troels XO design which incorporates three HF settings. One is "Flat" one is "Scandinavian Tuning" (I have dubbed it) and one is rolled off further still. The Scandinavian Tuning is how they were set when I received them, but quickly realised that the Flat tuning was how to get the best from them in my room. The rockwool panels causing the Troels tuning to sound more rolled off due to the reduction of reflection points around the speakers. However, for the purpose of Ian's visit, I rolled them back to the Troels setting. Fair play to Ian, he spotted the roll off and after a few minutes of pissing about behind the speakers, we were set back up at "Flat" For me, this is where the diction in vocals starts to really show up. In Troels mode, the Terry Evans LP sounds like he has a slight speech impediment...like he's mumbling. In Flat mode, the diction improves and the vocals clean right up and it's clarity personified. The rest of the session was set like that and yes, Terry Evans sounded utterly sublime, I have to agree. I enjoyed the session. It's always nice to hear new to me music. Be slightly careful with the terms 'flat' and 'Troels setting' as that is not universal on all of his speaker's measurements. It will depend on the tweeter characteristics too, and particular tuning for that specific speaker. Yes, Troels obviously voices his speakers to the Troels setting - that is sometimes 'flat' and sometimes 1-2db rolled off relative to the midrange. These are his Ekta measurements:  (red line, graduations are 5dB) Here is an example of different attenuation settings on the Illuminator 71:  The amount of room damping (absorption) will have a more profound effect on the perceived level of treble. The room could cause a roll off of many dB. I have heard the Arke Duos in 5 rooms now and the perceived treble level varies a lot. |
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Nov 1, 2022 7:34:38 GMT
Excellent explanation.
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