Post by optical on Jun 14, 2022 7:57:59 GMT
The internet can be a dangerous place . . . .
For example after taking delivery of my Martin Logans a while ago I furiously started googling 'upgrades, maintenance, ways to improve' etc etc, as you do.
Reading through the usual recap/ return to spec recommendations, one suggestion really stuck out, for obvious reasons.
"Bung em in the shower" . . . or words to that effect.
Was it written on April 1st or indeed by one of these guys just trying to provoke a reaction? Possibly a disgruntled employee of Martin Logan or at least one a bit low on repair jobs?
Well it wasn't just one person whom recommended this, it was actually a few different users, across different forums at different times . . . .
The panels on ML's are a little more robust than most (Quads, Soundlab etc), so I couldn't speak for doing it to other electrostatic speakers, but from the reports as long as you allow enough time for the panels to discharge and dry off completely, there were actually no reports of this not working. Although it could well just be the case that any users who did experience catastrophic failure, were indeed too embarrassed to document their spectacular (and expensive) cock-up.
Yes that's a full Panel (which hold upwards of 1000v of charge) in my shower. (I was going to put a shower cap on top where the wiring is but this is a serious thread you know?).
And yes, that is the Mrs' hair dryer (on a cold setting of course, don't want to melt the stators or put them through any more of an ordeal than they have just experienced).
I did leave the full 24hrs that most recommended to dry off the panels, luckily it was a fairly warm night and indeed day yesterday so that was working in my favour.
Switched the speakers on, one was fine with a very familiar, gentle (and somewhat satisfying) power up hum which disappears after a second or so, indicating that the panel is now fully charged and ready to play.
The other one however, made an odd popping surging sound which I can only describe as a worrying crackle of static. I pulled the plug immediately, hoping my worst fears would not be realised.
I thought about what to do, should I take it apart and dry it out again, should I contact someone hoe might know a little more about what I'm doing/have done than me?
No, plug it back in again, if it's knackered, it's knackered and I doubt I'm going to make it any worse. . . . . haha.
However, I did notice (and remember) the little wires feeding the charge to the panel were slightly 'squashed' into the recess of the panel where there was a chance they were touching each other and indeed shorting out. Also there had been a previous repair (I could tell this had occurred as the other speaker's wires were all neatly arranged into said recess without any exposed slack/excess) which had resulted in there being a bit of a solder 'blob' on one of the connections. This did increase the chance of a short fairly significantly, so I re-routed the cables so as to lessen the tension when the panel was back in position.
Switched it on again, woohoo! We have the reassuring power up surge, minus any pops or crackles.
Must be getting there now . . . .
I go to press play on the streamer, nothing happens. No problem, with the amount of chopping and changing I've done, something is bound to have been turned off/incorrect source selected etc etc.
5 minutes later, oh dear, still no sound at all. I feared the worst (again) . . . .
Streamer - ok
Mutec - ok (hadn't changed a thing)
DAC - ok
Pre - ok
Power - ok
So what's going on . . . .
Those of you with a Mutec (the growing number!) will probably know there is a setting to limit the number of lights visible, a setting I prefer as I have enough different coloured lights looking at me from my listening position. Some may be harder than others but mine is (and was from new) the most difficult button pressing combination (press and hold both at the same time) to toggle this display setting. You can be as synchronised as you like, sometimes it just doesn't have it and as a result of your failed attempt to press the buttons simultaneously, you invariably mess up one of the settings and have to cycle through them again. It's not the end of the world just really annoying if you have to change settings much, which thankfully I don't.
As the Mutec has been a 'stick in and forget' item, I haven't ever changed the settings, there has just been no need.
When I did eventually manage to nail the sync of the press I realised that somehow the Mutec had gone in to 'internal' reclock mode. The reduced light setting where it doesn't display anything other than the essential lights (input and lock I think) still looked exactly the same so for all purposes as far as I was concerned nothing had changed! I'm not sure how it did this as I had it playing the day prior to this and hadn't touched it, but I'm putting it down to one of those freak electrical gremlins that reside in our components from time to time (especially when you're doing something a little 'risky' shall we say . . . .
Right, now we had sound back in the room again, thank the lord. My heart rate became significantly less erratic at this point.
So what effect has taking 20yrs worth of dust and crap off thin mylar panels (which were probably carrying double the mass weight of said panels as a result) had on the sound.
Before shower:
After shower:
I mean how bleeding obvious is that! The stators are now literally transparent, where as before there was a slightly dull hew to them, although I didn't think it was particularly dull until I saw the clean one!
Well it has certainly changed the sound. I wasn't being particularly critical of it until they had fully 'settled' back in so I left them playing for an hour or so.
Initially impressions are that (I know this is the biggest cliche in hifi) a 'veil' had been lifted. Well this might be the only time this has been used as a phrase in the most literal sense. A layer of crap has been removed from the very surface from which the sound emits, so it does make total sense.
This 'freebie' upgrade hasn't come without somewhat of a price to pay however. . . . .
One of the reasons for doing this was another attempt to 'rebalance' the output from the panels. One of them has always been a couple of db output down from the other one. It's not really that noticeable, only really at low listening levels late at night, when you crank them a bit they seem to even out, but it does distract me on occasion.
Well now, the panel which has had the repair (which previously had the lower output), yes you guessed it, now that's the one with the higher output. Not by much at all though probably down to 1db or less so it really is not noticeable unless you are surgically listening for it on tracks you know inside out. I suspect with a little more tweaking of placement and possible some rearranging of acoustic treatment, I can even things up to be 'perfect'.
After a few conversations with Oli we came to the conclusion that perhaps these Logans were a little 'coloured' (not enough to distract from the music or give a false tonal impression exactly) just enough to be leaning towards the 'warm' side of presentation. Not something I've ever had an issue with to be honest.
Well I'd say after the panels have been cleaned, it's rebalanced that tendency a bit, in favour of a cleaner, sharper presentation.
I'll update with my continued thoughts as I haven't got many hours on the clean panels yet and there's a chance they still need to settle down a bit and go through a few charge/discharge cycles, but overall I'm very pleased . . . . after practically having a heart attack upon initial switch on 😂
Risk and reward . . . . a fine line indeed, one which I feel I have ridden my luck on a little this time.
Note to self - leave highly charged, fragile electrical stators another 20 years before showing them a shower head or indeed a hair dryer . . . .
For example after taking delivery of my Martin Logans a while ago I furiously started googling 'upgrades, maintenance, ways to improve' etc etc, as you do.
Reading through the usual recap/ return to spec recommendations, one suggestion really stuck out, for obvious reasons.
"Bung em in the shower" . . . or words to that effect.
Was it written on April 1st or indeed by one of these guys just trying to provoke a reaction? Possibly a disgruntled employee of Martin Logan or at least one a bit low on repair jobs?
Well it wasn't just one person whom recommended this, it was actually a few different users, across different forums at different times . . . .
The panels on ML's are a little more robust than most (Quads, Soundlab etc), so I couldn't speak for doing it to other electrostatic speakers, but from the reports as long as you allow enough time for the panels to discharge and dry off completely, there were actually no reports of this not working. Although it could well just be the case that any users who did experience catastrophic failure, were indeed too embarrassed to document their spectacular (and expensive) cock-up.
Yes that's a full Panel (which hold upwards of 1000v of charge) in my shower. (I was going to put a shower cap on top where the wiring is but this is a serious thread you know?).
And yes, that is the Mrs' hair dryer (on a cold setting of course, don't want to melt the stators or put them through any more of an ordeal than they have just experienced).
I did leave the full 24hrs that most recommended to dry off the panels, luckily it was a fairly warm night and indeed day yesterday so that was working in my favour.
Switched the speakers on, one was fine with a very familiar, gentle (and somewhat satisfying) power up hum which disappears after a second or so, indicating that the panel is now fully charged and ready to play.
The other one however, made an odd popping surging sound which I can only describe as a worrying crackle of static. I pulled the plug immediately, hoping my worst fears would not be realised.
I thought about what to do, should I take it apart and dry it out again, should I contact someone hoe might know a little more about what I'm doing/have done than me?
No, plug it back in again, if it's knackered, it's knackered and I doubt I'm going to make it any worse. . . . . haha.
However, I did notice (and remember) the little wires feeding the charge to the panel were slightly 'squashed' into the recess of the panel where there was a chance they were touching each other and indeed shorting out. Also there had been a previous repair (I could tell this had occurred as the other speaker's wires were all neatly arranged into said recess without any exposed slack/excess) which had resulted in there being a bit of a solder 'blob' on one of the connections. This did increase the chance of a short fairly significantly, so I re-routed the cables so as to lessen the tension when the panel was back in position.
Switched it on again, woohoo! We have the reassuring power up surge, minus any pops or crackles.
Must be getting there now . . . .
I go to press play on the streamer, nothing happens. No problem, with the amount of chopping and changing I've done, something is bound to have been turned off/incorrect source selected etc etc.
5 minutes later, oh dear, still no sound at all. I feared the worst (again) . . . .
Streamer - ok
Mutec - ok (hadn't changed a thing)
DAC - ok
Pre - ok
Power - ok
So what's going on . . . .
Those of you with a Mutec (the growing number!) will probably know there is a setting to limit the number of lights visible, a setting I prefer as I have enough different coloured lights looking at me from my listening position. Some may be harder than others but mine is (and was from new) the most difficult button pressing combination (press and hold both at the same time) to toggle this display setting. You can be as synchronised as you like, sometimes it just doesn't have it and as a result of your failed attempt to press the buttons simultaneously, you invariably mess up one of the settings and have to cycle through them again. It's not the end of the world just really annoying if you have to change settings much, which thankfully I don't.
As the Mutec has been a 'stick in and forget' item, I haven't ever changed the settings, there has just been no need.
When I did eventually manage to nail the sync of the press I realised that somehow the Mutec had gone in to 'internal' reclock mode. The reduced light setting where it doesn't display anything other than the essential lights (input and lock I think) still looked exactly the same so for all purposes as far as I was concerned nothing had changed! I'm not sure how it did this as I had it playing the day prior to this and hadn't touched it, but I'm putting it down to one of those freak electrical gremlins that reside in our components from time to time (especially when you're doing something a little 'risky' shall we say . . . .
Right, now we had sound back in the room again, thank the lord. My heart rate became significantly less erratic at this point.
So what effect has taking 20yrs worth of dust and crap off thin mylar panels (which were probably carrying double the mass weight of said panels as a result) had on the sound.
Before shower:
After shower:
I mean how bleeding obvious is that! The stators are now literally transparent, where as before there was a slightly dull hew to them, although I didn't think it was particularly dull until I saw the clean one!
Well it has certainly changed the sound. I wasn't being particularly critical of it until they had fully 'settled' back in so I left them playing for an hour or so.
Initially impressions are that (I know this is the biggest cliche in hifi) a 'veil' had been lifted. Well this might be the only time this has been used as a phrase in the most literal sense. A layer of crap has been removed from the very surface from which the sound emits, so it does make total sense.
This 'freebie' upgrade hasn't come without somewhat of a price to pay however. . . . .
One of the reasons for doing this was another attempt to 'rebalance' the output from the panels. One of them has always been a couple of db output down from the other one. It's not really that noticeable, only really at low listening levels late at night, when you crank them a bit they seem to even out, but it does distract me on occasion.
Well now, the panel which has had the repair (which previously had the lower output), yes you guessed it, now that's the one with the higher output. Not by much at all though probably down to 1db or less so it really is not noticeable unless you are surgically listening for it on tracks you know inside out. I suspect with a little more tweaking of placement and possible some rearranging of acoustic treatment, I can even things up to be 'perfect'.
After a few conversations with Oli we came to the conclusion that perhaps these Logans were a little 'coloured' (not enough to distract from the music or give a false tonal impression exactly) just enough to be leaning towards the 'warm' side of presentation. Not something I've ever had an issue with to be honest.
Well I'd say after the panels have been cleaned, it's rebalanced that tendency a bit, in favour of a cleaner, sharper presentation.
I'll update with my continued thoughts as I haven't got many hours on the clean panels yet and there's a chance they still need to settle down a bit and go through a few charge/discharge cycles, but overall I'm very pleased . . . . after practically having a heart attack upon initial switch on 😂
Risk and reward . . . . a fine line indeed, one which I feel I have ridden my luck on a little this time.
Note to self - leave highly charged, fragile electrical stators another 20 years before showing them a shower head or indeed a hair dryer . . . .
