optical
Moderator
BIG STAR
Be Excellent To Eachother
Posts: 1,555 
|
Post by optical on Sept 10, 2021 11:56:46 GMT
Hi chaps, how would one go about removing the protective casing of these C3G tubes?  My DAC only accepts the 'naked' tube without it's protective case. Doesn't seem to twist much (don't want to force it) but there is a ridge with a slight lip where I assume the top separates from the bottom. Gently heating it? A flat-head screw driver? Rubberised pliers? They ain't that cheap so don't want to damage them! Cheers Chris |
|
Bigman80
Grandmaster
AA Founding Member & Bigbottle Audio Creator
Posts: 16,062
|
Post by Bigman80 on Sept 10, 2021 12:00:37 GMT
Hi chaps, how would one go about removing the protective casing of these C3G tubes? My DAC only accepts the 'naked' tube without it's protective case. Doesn't seem to twist much (don't want to force it) but there is a ridge with a slight lip where I assume the top separates from the bottom. Gently heating it? A flat-head screw driver? Rubberised pliers? They ain't that cheap so don't want to damage them! Cheers Chris No idea Chris. Maybe firebottle has a hack |
|
|
|
Post by firebottle on Sept 10, 2021 13:39:15 GMT
Haven't a clue, never had the need or opportunity.
|
|
optical
Moderator
BIG STAR
Be Excellent To Eachother
Posts: 1,555
|
Post by optical on Sept 10, 2021 13:56:16 GMT
After some more in depth googling, it appears it 'should' come off . . . . Sounds like I just need to give it a bit more elbow grease. www.jacmusic.com/techcorner/ARTICLES/English/Portraits/C3g/C3g-C3m-info.htmlThey are lovely tubes by the way. I've heard the C3M (older non grid/gold pins) as drivers for my 300B amp and the C3G in my TDA1541 DAC on the output stage, they are rather special. Probably my favorite tubes. |
|
Bigman80
Grandmaster
AA Founding Member & Bigbottle Audio Creator
Posts: 16,062
|
Post by Bigman80 on Sept 10, 2021 14:36:17 GMT
After some more in depth googling, it appears it 'should' come off . . . . Sounds like I just need to give it a bit more elbow grease. www.jacmusic.com/techcorner/ARTICLES/English/Portraits/C3g/C3g-C3m-info.htmlThey are lovely tubes by the way. I've heard the C3M (older non grid/gold pins) as drivers for my 300B amp and the C3G in my TDA1541 DAC on the output stage, they are rather special. Probably my favorite tubes. Pics of the guts when you've managed. |
|
optical
Moderator
BIG STAR
Be Excellent To Eachother
Posts: 1,555
|
Post by optical on Sept 10, 2021 14:46:00 GMT
After some more in depth googling, it appears it 'should' come off . . . . Sounds like I just need to give it a bit more elbow grease. www.jacmusic.com/techcorner/ARTICLES/English/Portraits/C3g/C3g-C3m-info.htmlThey are lovely tubes by the way. I've heard the C3M (older non grid/gold pins) as drivers for my 300B amp and the C3G in my TDA1541 DAC on the output stage, they are rather special. Probably my favorite tubes. Pics of the guts when you've managed. Sure thing Ol. In there mean time here are some generic shots of the same tube. Apparently very precise tolerances were adhered to in manufacture. Hence their super low noise. I'll post a pic of them in action too (as I already have some which have been stripped of their case in my DAC, I just wanted to have some spares and try different ones).  |
|
Bigman80
Grandmaster
AA Founding Member & Bigbottle Audio Creator
Posts: 16,062
|
Post by Bigman80 on Sept 10, 2021 15:18:20 GMT
Pics of the guts when you've managed. Sure thing Ol. In there mean time here are some generic shots of the same tube. Apparently very precise tolerances were adhered to in manufacture. Hence their super low noise. I'll post a pic of them in action too (as I already have some which have been stripped of their case in my DAC, I just wanted to have some spares and try different ones). Oooooo, they look cool! |
|
|
|
Post by sq225917 on Sept 10, 2021 18:59:50 GMT
That really does look like a meticulously made thing
|
|
optical
Moderator
BIG STAR
Be Excellent To Eachother
Posts: 1,555
|
Post by optical on Sept 10, 2021 20:30:44 GMT
That really does look like a meticulously made thing They certainly are that. Thick glass, gold grids/pins and none of the usual tooling scratches/scorches or marks on the plates. Still trying to get the new ruddy ones open though! |
|
|
|
Post by mikeyb on Sept 11, 2021 6:32:58 GMT
|
|
optical
Moderator
BIG STAR
Be Excellent To Eachother
Posts: 1,555
|
Post by optical on Sept 11, 2021 7:29:12 GMT
Hi, yes they are the exact ones being discussed in the thread but unless I'm missing a vital part of the puzzle, removal is a lot easier said than done.... The term "peel" implies you have to make some kind of incision (which is certainly viable with thin aluminium) so it may be a case of making a hole and going for it! Aside from their difficulty to access, the more I read about them the more I realise why they sound as good as they do. A few years ago an amp builder told me they were simply the best preamp tubes ever made, I thought he was just bigging up his own design (it was a 300B amp using c3m's as preamp tubes). Seems he had reason to wax lyrical though. As mentioned I have the C3G's in combination with a TDA1541 DAC and musicality is off the scale. Never seen a DAC with this combination before either. |
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Sept 11, 2021 7:32:28 GMT
To me, it looks like the blue band may need to come off, and it might make life easier.
All this is based on a photo, and no experience of the valve, so feel free to ignore/discard the post like yesterdays news paper.
|
|
|
|
Post by mikeyb on Sept 11, 2021 7:42:09 GMT
I'd be inclined to try sharp pointed scissors and try cutting it if you can get the tip into that lip you mention.
|
|
optical
Moderator
BIG STAR
Be Excellent To Eachother
Posts: 1,555
|
Post by optical on Sept 11, 2021 7:51:24 GMT
To me, it looks like the blue band may need to come off, and it might make life easier. All this is based on a photo, and no experience of the valve, so feel free to ignore/discard the post like yesterdays news paper. Mine doesn't actually have the blue band but I'm not sure it was for anything other than aesthetics. It's machine tight to the base as in they weren't expecting anyone to ever open them..... |
|
optical
Moderator
BIG STAR
Be Excellent To Eachother
Posts: 1,555
|
Post by optical on Sept 11, 2021 7:52:43 GMT
I'd be inclined to try sharp pointed scissors and try cutting it if you can get the tip into that lip you mention. Yeah..... I'm gonna have to hack into the sucka I reckon!! |
|
optical
Moderator
BIG STAR
Be Excellent To Eachother
Posts: 1,555
|
Post by optical on Oct 7, 2021 13:02:04 GMT
So just to update this I took a pair of sharp-nose pliers to the 'lip' near the base. Made a small incision and started to peel it away whilst being careful not to touch the glass. Not particularly easy to do at all as it did not want to come away, anyway after some peeling, prizing and a couple of sore thumbs both tubes were free of their cages and happily playing away in the DAC.   |
|
|
|
Post by firebottle on Oct 7, 2021 15:45:07 GMT
Good result.
|
|
|
|
Post by antonio on Oct 8, 2021 0:05:30 GMT
You're a brave man, well done, of course what we really want to know is, how do they sound.
|
|
optical
Moderator
BIG STAR
Be Excellent To Eachother
Posts: 1,555
|
Post by optical on Oct 8, 2021 7:49:21 GMT
You're a brave man, well done, of course what we really want to know is, how do they sound. Well they sound pretty much the same as the tubes which were in there before (which is a good thing!) but I just wanted to bag a 'spare' set before prices creep up or availability dies out . . . Sp far the only difference I can detect between the 'Lorenz' and 'Siemens' tubes is that the 'Lorenz' are a little more spacious but lose out a tad to the 'Siemens' in the bass department. Although they are very very close in all aspects. Of course they may get even closer in performance once they are properly burned in as they onlt have 20 hours on them or so. With a life-span of 10,000 hours+ they probably have quite a slow burn in I'd imagine! They should see me out with a life span like that . . . and I'm still in me 30's! Cheers |
|
|
|
Post by antonio on Oct 8, 2021 21:02:02 GMT
In yer 30's, are you sure you shouldn't be in the nursery section of this forum  |
|
optical
Moderator
BIG STAR
Be Excellent To Eachother
Posts: 1,555
|
Post by optical on Oct 9, 2021 8:25:41 GMT
In yer 30's, are you sure you shouldn't be in the nursery section of this forum I was actually looking for it, is it past the bingo hall and up the stannah stair lift?....😉 I seem to have alienated most of my own generational peers, possibly by talking aggressively about hifi at them.... Their loss I say.... |
|
Bigman80
Grandmaster
AA Founding Member & Bigbottle Audio Creator
Posts: 16,062
|
Post by Bigman80 on Oct 9, 2021 10:07:52 GMT
In yer 30's, are you sure you shouldn't be in the nursery section of this forum I was actually looking for it, is it past the bingo hall and up the stannah stair lift?....😉 I seem to have alienated most of my own generational peers, possibly by talking aggressively about hifi at them.... Their loss I say.... Dont worry about the wrinklys, Chris.....you and I will keep the HiFi going for our generation! 80' babies rule! |
|
|
|
Post by electronumpty on Oct 9, 2021 10:28:54 GMT
Bah! Whippersnappers !
|
|
|
|
Post by gninnam on Oct 9, 2021 10:43:33 GMT
Born in the 80's - ban them I say...........
|
|
|
|
Post by macca on Oct 9, 2021 12:42:57 GMT
my oppo at work was born in 1990. I could never get my head around that. Outside of work it made for a difficult relationship. She'd never heard of anything that was familiar to me and I'd never heard of anything that was familiar to her.
|
|
optical
Moderator
BIG STAR
Be Excellent To Eachother
Posts: 1,555
|
Post by optical on Oct 9, 2021 13:03:29 GMT
my oppo at work was born in 1990. I could never get my head around that. Outside of work it made for a difficult relationship. She'd never heard of anything that was familiar to me and I'd never heard of anything that was familiar to her. Agreed, my sister was born in '90.... Different breed altogether. Genuinely have more in common with most 70yr olds than I do 25's.... For a minute I thought you were talking about a CD transport (oppo) haha. |
|
|
|
Post by macca on Oct 9, 2021 13:24:44 GMT
I think the internet becoming ubiquitous is the big divider. That and Harry Potter.
|
|
|
|
Post by paul49720 on Apr 13, 2023 16:25:12 GMT
You're a brave man, well done, of course what we really want to know is, how do they sound. Well they sound pretty much the same as the tubes which were in there before (which is a good thing!) but I just wanted to bag a 'spare' set before prices creep up or availability dies out . . . Sp far the only difference I can detect between the 'Lorenz' and 'Siemens' tubes is that the 'Lorenz' are a little more spacious but lose out a tad to the 'Siemens' in the bass department. Although they are very very close in all aspects. Of course they may get even closer in performance once they are properly burned in as they onlt have 20 hours on them or so. With a life-span of 10,000 hours+ they probably have quite a slow burn in I'd imagine! Hello, I would be pleased to know if the C3G's you placed after removing their metal can outer covers replaced model C3G of another manufacturer / factory / year, or C3m ? I use the factory supplied Siemens C3m in an AD1 valved Yamamoto A 06 3 SET and I am wondering whether to try, if I understand correctly, the different construction of the C3g, with frame grid and gold pins. Any insight on the difference of sound I might experience would be greatly appreciated. Enjoy your music. Best regards, Paul |
|
optical
Moderator
BIG STAR
Be Excellent To Eachother
Posts: 1,555
|
Post by optical on Apr 13, 2023 17:10:56 GMT
Well they sound pretty much the same as the tubes which were in there before (which is a good thing!) but I just wanted to bag a 'spare' set before prices creep up or availability dies out . . . Sp far the only difference I can detect between the 'Lorenz' and 'Siemens' tubes is that the 'Lorenz' are a little more spacious but lose out a tad to the 'Siemens' in the bass department. Although they are very very close in all aspects. Of course they may get even closer in performance once they are properly burned in as they onlt have 20 hours on them or so. With a life-span of 10,000 hours+ they probably have quite a slow burn in I'd imagine! Hello, I would be pleased to know if the C3G's you placed after removing their metal can outer covers replaced model C3G of another manufacturer / factory / year, or C3m ? I use the factory supplied Siemens C3m in an AD1 valved Yamamoto A 06 3 SET and I am wondering whether to try, if I understand correctly, the different construction of the C3g, with frame grid and gold pins. Any insight on the difference of sound I might experience would be greatly appreciated. Enjoy your music. Best regards, Paul Hi Paul, they replaced some identical (model) C3G's. I had some Lorenz branded ones and these Siemens. Overall I think the Siemens were better but I sold the DAC shortly afterwards so can't really talk about them long term! The DAC was designed to work with C3G model only but I believe C3M (popular driver in 300b amps etc) would probably have worked although they do differ slightly in heater current and plate voltage I believe so would be worth checking. All the C3M and C3G valves I've heard have always been really good actually. It seems the design and manufacture of most of them (thick glass, hefty pins etc) is more responsible for their quality sound than the difference between brands, unlike some valve models. However if I got some again it would likely be Siemens as I trust them. |
|
|
|
Post by paul49720 on Apr 13, 2023 20:26:02 GMT
hi, thank you for replying so quickly. well, you are spot on. I checked with the European importer and indeed the two valves are sufficiently different in values that I should use only C3m. And there is only one version. And I hold a spare set. So all calm on that front. Thanks once again. Paul
|
|
