Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Jun 18, 2019 18:33:56 GMT
By the way, didn't you say that you hated DNM cables, Westie? S. The speaker cables were the ones I hated. I could imagine them being good on tweeters with a bigger amp setup bit they had no bass. |
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Post by dsjr on Jun 18, 2019 18:46:17 GMT
I know this shouldn't be posted in this section. I'm possibly looking at maybe getting NVA 'Super Sound Cords' to use on my headphone system. Are the SSC shielded to reject hum etc? Forgive my witless question here. Does the SSC have the potential to out perform interconnects costing in the £300-£350 region? S.
SSC is unshielded in the conventional sense. It uses two lengths of selected RG416U (there are different grades and I have examples of two types here, which strip back very differently and the 'screens' are different too to handle, despite looking the same) one for hot and the other for return. The screens are insulated off and act as kind-of Faraday cages. Mine work well and the sound is fleshed out over single SC I find. SSPmk2 takes it a lot closer to the TIS but perceived value for money comes in obviously. All this may well be academic though.
Interconnects costing £300 or so are wonderful cash cows for dealers. Please bear this in mind. One company often spoken of gives dealers 60& margin and another mentioned give the dealers 75%, so a £300 cable retail costs the dealer £75 inc VAT. Do bear this in mind...
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Post by Deleted on Jun 18, 2019 19:01:55 GMT
Thanks, DSJR.
S.
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Jun 18, 2019 19:05:58 GMT
Loaner sets of NVA cables to compare would be a good thing, I’m thinking of having the chance to try SC against SSC or SSC against SSP. Or LS2 against LS1. With the interconnects at least, materials costs and postage costs wouldn’t be prohibitive,
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Post by dsjr on Jun 18, 2019 19:44:05 GMT
This was offered on TAS and some parties there complained and helped to put the kibosh on it if you remember. The loan scheme worked too because i thought people made their decisions after comparisons at home in their own stereos... That's how I got to hear the SSPmk2 compared to both the SC and SSC along with my own TIS.
A shame that it ended.
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Jun 18, 2019 19:50:41 GMT
This was offered on TAS and some parties there complained and helped to put the kibosh on it if you remember. The loan scheme worked too because i thought people made their decisions after comparisons at home in their own stereos... That's how I got to hear the SSPmk2 compared to both the SC and SSC along with my own TIS. A shame that it ended. I wasn’t just proposing a single cable though. I understood most people just borrowed one cable. I was thinking of two or more for comparison. A bit of a twist on loans. |
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Post by savvypaul on Jun 18, 2019 21:29:35 GMT
So the differences between the small amps and big ones (to try and explain some people's loss of the magic) 1) All use exactly the same amp boards, wire, case material 2) Transformers get bigger as you go up the range 3) Bigger capacitance in the psu (two caps in parallel in some cases) 4) There is an extra psu in the larger models so output stage gets a dedicated psu, so does the front end and driver transistors. So could the dullness be due to too much power supply capacitance ? Or it must be the extra psu . It shouldn't be related to the larger transformer unless the stray field is causing problems. Larger transformer = lower impedance and i wouldn't have thought that would lead to a dulling down of the performance. Or maybe people just like the sound of soft clipping ? I did wonder about the supplied transformers in my examples being from a duff batch. I seem to recall someone saying they aren’t a very reliable brand, but I don’t remember the details. An earlier thread established that Nick Gorham used the same company... Post by Lurcher300b » Thu Jul 19, 2018 7:37 am I will just add that I use Vigortronix all the time in power supplies and amps. Good transformers, they have made custom ones for me and I use loads of their stock values. All come with the correct paperwork and test certs. www.hifisubjectivist.org/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=46412&p=176453&hilit=transformers#p176453 |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 19, 2019 8:48:11 GMT
I wouldn’t spend half my life fiddling with interconnects but I’m glad I had the last round of comparisons. Big losers were Klotz AC110 with Profi plugs and the white Isoda cable that Roksan like. It sounded like the throwaway ones you got given with cheap jap kit in the 80s. I quite liked the Audio Note AN-C but it wouldn’t compete with a top cable.I also like the AN-C. It gets all the basics right and has no nasties. |
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Post by dsjr on Jun 19, 2019 9:02:03 GMT
One school of thought was that if an expensive cable differed hugely in tone if not clarity from a basic patch cord, then it was doing something wrong.
The Klotz cables I found for some reason, is that if they're made up and used for some time - say six months, they cease to have much of any any 'sound' at all in my experience. Mind you, the Mark Grant HD1500 did this too and blind, I couldn't tell the difference from the Klotz MC5000 which I used to think sounded 'very' different when first made up/purchased... I used the Klotz 5000 in preference for years because I preferred the black colour of the outer jacket - I've now re-connected the outer screens at one end too, as I sometimes got interference in this wore with the outer screen left floating.... Similar with cable 'direction' which if audible at all when new (NVA cables aren't directional I find), cease to be an issue after some use.
The thing is, all these comparisons are usually sighted and the longer I go on and think about it all (having little else to do right now), I'm beginning to realise that our other senses and in particular sight, play such a huge part in our preferences and eventual decisions.
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Jun 19, 2019 15:22:56 GMT
I used to quite like Klotz until I AB compared it. It was lacking in so many areas, I couldn’t go back. The problem I have is that it shouldn’t be lacking, it’s well made, doesn’t do anything unconventional in terms of construction and it’s not going to conduct signal any worse than other decent cables.
All I can conclude is that there are other factors affecting sound, perception or both. I also think cables can be system dependent.
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NVA AP20
Jun 19, 2019 19:44:20 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jun 19, 2019 19:44:20 GMT
I used to quite like Klotz until I AB compared it. It was lacking in so many areas, I couldn’t go back. The problem I have is that it shouldn’t be lacking, it’s well made, doesn’t do anything unconventional in terms of construction and it’s not going to conduct signal any worse than other decent cables. All I can conclude is that there are other factors affecting sound, perception or both. I also think cables can be system dependent. I had Klotz for a long time and thought it was great, UNTILL I tried some Yannis cables which, even though now I don't use them, they danced all over the Klotz in ways I didn't even knew existed. That said, I was by no means at the level of system I have now. Maybe I should try another pair but I suspect that if they failed previously, they definitely would now. Like you Andrew, I think sometimes a system may not be as responsive to comparisons with cables. Anyway, the SSC and the like won't compete imo. I've done those tests extensively. If you have NVA gear, then the NVA cables seem to work really well. Just my 2p |
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