Cables - Rip off or Essential

Early stuff by John Curl. Very good amps.

Depending on what boxes they are strung between I have on occasion found differences between interconnects and speaker cables. Subtle but there nonetheless, enough for me to have a preference. 

Example:

NVA passive pre and various power amps incl Krell - tried a lot of interconnects and settled on NVA SSC. Did an informal blind test to see if I could tell the differences between some of the cables I thought sounded best (NVA) and worst (Mark Grant Canare). Freebie leads you get with cd players came second last btw. I could reliably (10 out of 10) tell the difference between the best and worst - although it was much, much harder to do blind than I thought it would be. I had to use a specific portion of one track and play it over and over.

What we think are big differences sighted turn into tiny differences (or none) when you are blind to what kit is in use. Scary!

Nva pre  and Krell power -Spotfire interconnects sound slow in the bass (but only on some material). Weird but very obvious. 

Swap to DCB1 unity gain pre, Krell power, Spotfire interconnects now sound fine, especially good in the bass. 

So whilst you might have to do something really weird with the cables LCR parameters to get what the textbook says will be an audible effect, the matching of the boxes they connect also plays a part and can amplify the effect even if the textbook says the LCR is within the acceptable range. That's my theory (for Jez to shoot down).


And that's to say a lot of the differences we think we hear with cable changes are totally imaginary because they certainly are. But there can be real differences too, enough to matter.  

It's a theory, the only problem with it is that I've used the NVA pre amp into loads of different amps and with loads of other different interconnects with no audible problem. In bake offs where I've slotted it in when doing comparisons I've just used whatever interconnects were already in there. Never had an issue like the slow bass, although I agree it sounds best with NVA interconnects.


It's a stepped attenuator passive pre. Some wire and some resistors. So what could be adding coloration? All passives don't sound the same of course so clearly none can be 100% transparent, but in a bake off against the Music First Reference TVC I could not hear any difference at all. I suppose that could be coloured too and in the same way.

Your Kung Foo is good, but what you or I think is good is not necessarily someone else's idea of good so that's useless as a marker.

I still think we are talking about the same matching issues as I originally described. The cables and the boxes they connect interact, sometimes the combination of all three just doesn't work but none of the individual items is actually at fault. Or if they are it isn't easy to determine which one or why. Which is not to say you are wrong, I'm just not 100% convinced you are right.

You'll not be surprised that I disagree with everything said since my last post! Everything and from both of yer!

Been using Van Damme cables now for a couple years. Don't see any need in changing.

S.

I still believe that our eyes play a HUGE part in how we 'hear' equipment. For wealthy but otherweise tech-ignorant audiophiles, the posher it looks and the higher it costs plays a huge part in the buying decision.

That's a big part of it yes. The bling factor and the "it's expensive so it must be good" thing... The biggest problem though by far is the tech ignorance of audiophiles which means probably 80% + of everything said on forums is total bollox!
By and large everything that matters to audiophiles is bollox and not even technically possible in many cases, we see up thread that selector switches and wire are important which is completely wrong of course. They have no effect at all.
Conversely, most things which actually are very important are barely discussed, if at all!

Car analogy time again... Audiophiles are like car enthusiasts who only ever discuss and carry out things like wheel blackening, changing seat covers, or scent sticks, the pros and cons of furry dice, which go faster stripes are the fastest etc... Unfortunately they believe such stuff actually effects MPH, MPG 0-60 etc and when told by pro motor engineers that it's all bollox and they need to fit high lift cams, re-mapped ECU's and a limited slip diff they go all "we don't need experts", fingers in ears and "la, la, la"....

A whole industry exists to rip people off with total arse gravy accessories in much the same way that cosmetics are sold to vain women... any one with two brain cells knows that "age reversal cremes" etc do not and can not work but they sell in huge amounts anyway.
Hence in any forum we see loads of questions such as "which mains cable should i buy?" "what equipment supports should I get?" from people so brain washed that they not only think such things matter but believe the adverts etc above the facts presented by engineers... Sheer madness!

So Jez, are you suggesting that most of these audiophiles have low IQ?

S.

If I’m being honest, I think low emotional intelligence is a factor for some audiophiles

I just took you for a spaghetti lover!

Not always the case but I have found a few times that the Mk1 amp is considerably better than the Mark 2 and beyond. Denon PMA250 being a prime example. The later ones look more expensive but don't sound half as good.