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Post by macca on Nov 12, 2020 18:39:42 GMT
I think the other KEFs I mentioned would be better, but I think they are ported. Yes, you may be right but other reports suggest they are bass light. It's all in the ear of the listener I suppose. There's a full suite of measurements for them on ASR www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/kef-ls50-bookshelf-speaker-review.11144/The anechoic is very close to KEFs published spec. The estimated in room is pretty good for a not-that-pricey 2 way I think. The bass thing is easily explained by the peak at 100hz and the quick roll-off after that. Boosting the region around 100hz is the traditional way to give a small speaker an illusion of bass. 'Stunt bass' as DSJR calls it. If you usually listen to small speakers it will sound impressive. If you are used to large speakers not so much. Even though it doesn't sound bass light it still sounds like a small speaker. On the other hand it will work in a smaller room and it will image really well because of the dual-concentric driver. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 12, 2020 18:58:17 GMT
It’s the R3 that the comment was made about.
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Post by jandl100 on Nov 12, 2020 19:11:03 GMT
I bought and sold (to Stan Beresford) my Yammie 1000 speakers for £700, but that was probably about 12 maybe 14 years ago.
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Post by macca on Nov 12, 2020 20:38:37 GMT
It’s the R3 that the comment was made about. Oh right, must try to read more carefully. I blame the weird quote thingy on this site  |
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Nov 12, 2020 21:21:05 GMT
I am not too concerned that the KEF's may not have deep bass. What i want is for them to be transparent (see through), have good clarity, resolution and most importantly, Tone and Texture. If they have this and they communicate to me, i can then put the Quadral Sub in again and see if it integrates better, as this time i wouldn't be trying to make up for deficiencies in the mid range with it and therefore mangling the crossover point and killing the integration.
When i focussed solely on integrating the sub with the Galan 9's bottom end, and ignored the tonal aspect, it was almost inconspicuous so i know it can be done.
I think the Quadral Sub and the KEF's could prove a tougher match than most would think for the Yam's and this is what they will be up against. Effectively trying to make a quarter or half way house between the Ls50's and a KEF Blade sounds like it is worth a bit of effort!
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Post by jimbo on Nov 13, 2020 8:46:06 GMT
Just read an upcoming review on the B&W 705 stand mounts by John Atkinson in latest edition of Stereophile and he compares them against the KEF LS50 which he still rates highly and he noted the KEFs had better tonality but the B&W 705 had better transparency. There were many aspects of the LS50 that were better or equal to these 705 so they fared very well considering the huge price difference.
However KEF LS50 £1500 and the B&W 705 £4000!
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Post by sq225917 on Nov 13, 2020 20:30:27 GMT
The kef ref 302 i had in the old house were the most listenable speaker/ room combo ive ever had. Though they go lower, sparkle higher and have unbeatable mids the yammies dont compare, at least in this room.
Square boxes, who knew?
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Nov 13, 2020 21:38:46 GMT
The kef ref 302 i had in the old house were the most listenable speaker/ room combo ive ever had. Though they go lower, sparkle higher and have unbeatable mids the yammies dont compare, at least in this room. Square boxes, who knew? Must say, I'm expecting the KEFs to do a reasonable job. I'm also quite convinced that with a small sub they may be pretty much spot on. I'm looking forward to them arriving and giving them a listen |
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Post by antonio on Nov 14, 2020 1:41:46 GMT
I'll start thinking about what sub to recommend now for when the question is asked.  |
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Post by gninnam on Nov 14, 2020 5:15:50 GMT
Oli - more than welcome to try my Revier Jenna's, for the smaller room they work really well
Just listening now and surprised how well they work.
Hate saying they are transparent as no such thing but in my system I enjoy what my ears are hearing.
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Post by gninnam on Nov 14, 2020 6:34:50 GMT
Morning Oli Just thinking of all the speakers I have had over the years and the best that worked with small and larger rooms were my Heybrook HB1's Gave them to my brother-in-law for his 50th (I bought them new in 1985) and they sound fantastic. For me sealed or front ported alway sound better to my ears. Now been up for 25 hours so I could be waffling... |
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Nov 14, 2020 8:05:06 GMT
Morning Oli Just thinking of all the speakers I have had over the years and the best that worked with small and larger rooms were my Heybrook HB1's Gave them to my brother-in-law for his 50th (I bought them new in 1985) and they sound fantastic. For me sealed or front ported alway sound better to my ears. Now been up for 25 hours so I could be waffling... Ha, yes the room i am in behaves far better with sealed cabs, so i totally get that sentiment. Thanks fo rthe loan offer btw, but i think the Yam' or the KEF's will probably be suitable....maybe both will and i will then be spoiled for choice? |
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Post by gninnam on Nov 14, 2020 8:17:03 GMT
Ha, yes the room i am in behaves far better with sealed cabs, so i totally get that sentiment. Thanks fo rthe loan offer btw, but i think the Yam' or the KEF's will probably be suitable....maybe both will and i will then be spoiled for choice? Hope one or the other works well for you. I have heard both but only in medium to large rooms and both worked well but not sure how they will interact with a smaller room (fingers crossed one of them gets close!) |
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Post by macca on Nov 14, 2020 8:19:08 GMT
I'm sort of hoping you will go for the KEFs so I can have the Yammies Still predicting that the Yams will blow the KEFs away though. I don't think it will even be close. |
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Nov 14, 2020 8:33:21 GMT
I'm sort of hoping you will go for the KEFs so I can have the Yammies Still predicting that the Yams will blow the KEFs away though. I don't think it will even be close. Well, I'm collecting from Warrington tomorrow, will be listening to them there, and then at home once I have sorted the binding posts out. KEFs should be here Monday/Tuesday I have some "real world priced" stands available on loan which I will collect later too. I expect there will be developments next week. If I don't want the Yams, and you do, I'll deliver them too. Can't argue with that! |
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Post by macca on Nov 14, 2020 9:20:47 GMT
Cool.
It's like the build-up to a major prize fight isn't it? The tension. The expectation. The endless punditry.
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Post by jandl100 on Nov 14, 2020 9:31:32 GMT
Expectation is great, but ime actual experience often goes down an unexpected route!
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Post by karma67 on Nov 14, 2020 9:34:13 GMT
I'm sort of hoping you will go for the KEFs so I can have the Yammies Still predicting that the Yams will blow the KEFs away though. I don't think it will even be close. Well, I'm collecting from Warrington tomorrow, will be listening to them there, and then at home once I have sorted the binding posts out. KEFs should be here Monday/Tuesday I have some "real world priced" stands available on loan which I will collect later too. I expect there will be developments next week. If I don't want the Yams, and you do, I'll deliver them too. Can't argue with that! leave the binding posts until you know they are staying,the posts are potted in glue and are hard to remove. binding post do not make a Sh#t speaker suddenly excellent and vice versa. i predict you will be amazed at the yamaha's mid range.
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Post by jimbo on Nov 14, 2020 9:52:17 GMT
My memory of the yams was a positive one but not an overwhelming "I would buy those". But the crossovers had been modified and were not in original state!
The LS50 is very familiar to me as I have heard it in my own system annd in a larger system. I liked it but felt it did not have enough scale. Yes it is neutral and does tight bass. Yes it has pinpoint soundstage and good resolution but I think the addition of a sub could take it to another level. Then I would definitely consider it in a small room. John Atkinson has I think been using it as a reference bookshelf speaker since 2012!
But I think there are far more suitable and slightly bigger stand mounts that will tick more boxes however i have always noted that many of these desireable stand mount speakers that would knock my Spendors out of the ring are very very expensive. We are talking £2000-£5000 +. The TAD ME1 stand mount speakers would be on this list but £12000!!!!!
I think the sheer size of the yammies is probably going to be more suitable purely from the sense of scale and the size of drivers are able to deliver reasonable bass. Only problem is taming that top end/midrange.
It is old school vs new school and the LS50 is avery well executed speaker that should work very well in your room Oli. It is refined and very controlled maybe a tad too much but with a sub.....who knows??
That is my prize fight pre match analysis!
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Post by macca on Nov 14, 2020 10:28:44 GMT
Well, I'm collecting from Warrington tomorrow, will be listening to them there, and then at home once I have sorted the binding posts out. KEFs should be here Monday/Tuesday I have some "real world priced" stands available on loan which I will collect later too. I expect there will be developments next week. If I don't want the Yams, and you do, I'll deliver them too. Can't argue with that! leave the binding posts until you know they are staying,the posts are potted in glue and are hard to remove. binding post do not make a Sh#t speaker suddenly excellent and vice versa. i predict you will be amazed at the yamaha's mid range.
Agree. You can jam a banana plug into them, I do that with my JBL Control Ones. Nowadays everyone associates spring clips with cheap and nasty speakers because now that's the only place you see them. But there's nothing wrong with them from a connection point of view. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 14, 2020 10:45:25 GMT
Open the listening room doors.
Engine upgrade No1.
Remember me in your will.
🙂
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Nov 14, 2020 11:24:36 GMT
My memory of the yams was a positive one but not an overwhelming "I would buy those". But the crossovers had been modified and were not in original state! The LS50 is very familiar to me as I have heard it in my own system annd in a larger system. I liked it but felt it did not have enough scale. Yes it is neutral and does tight bass. Yes it has pinpoint soundstage and good resolution but I think the addition of a sub could take it to another level. Then I would definitely consider it in a small room. John Atkinson has I think been using it as a reference bookshelf speaker since 2012! But I think there are far more suitable and slightly bigger stand mounts that will tick more boxes however i have always noted that many of these desireable stand mount speakers that would knock my Spendors out of the ring are very very expensive. We are talking £2000-£5000 +. The TAD ME1 stand mount speakers would be on this list but £12000!!!!! I think the sheer size of the yammies is probably going to be more suitable purely from the sense of scale and the size of drivers are able to deliver reasonable bass. Only problem is taming that top end/midrange. It is old school vs new school and the LS50 is avery well executed speaker that should work very well in your room Oli. It is refined and very controlled maybe a tad too much but with a sub.....who knows?? That is my prize fight pre match analysis! I know the KEF's are not famed for huge scale etc, but like you i think a sub will change that whole aspect of their performance. I have a sub here and believe me, all combinations will be reassesed, including the Qudrals! What i want is for the system to regain the tonal balance of the 880's as IMO, they were verys special. The Q1's have already spanked the 880's imaging ability as the room squashed them and the Q1's are working in a far better way due to their size in relation to the space. Dropping the sub onto the Q1's has given me confidence that the LS50's will grow in scale, dynamics and impact when i put the sub on them, but it's the precision, transparency and tonal balance i NEED from them, more than i need chest vibrating slam etc. I can even cope with a bit less resolution than i get with the Quadrals. I am less sensitive to that. If the LS50's do as i expect (hope) and then the addition of the sub does what i expect to, the Yamaha's will have to do something that the KEF LS50 cant do to be in with a shout of earning a long term place in the system. I have heard them before and i thought they were utterly superb. They were on the end of the MFA Monoblocks Nick Gorham makes. They were superb...seriously. The KEF's were a gut feeling. They just slapped me in the face when i saw a pair. Usually the gut get's it right. For me, to be able to have such highly regarded speakers at my disposal, is the stuff of fantasy. To date, the most expensive speakers i've bought were the Mordaunt Short 880's at £275.00 They are still the speaker to beat IMO, and i am still very sad they aren't here any more. The new owner loves them BTW, as i said he would. Doesn't make me feel any better though. I also now have 2 BB3's to build, so my week off which was going to be spent listening to Yams, Quadrals and KEF's is gone. This is going to take a wee bit longer than i had hoped. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 14, 2020 13:39:12 GMT
I think I know what the issue is.
It's the glass ceiling in your listening room, giving horrendous reflections. Either that, or the thread title is very misleading.
You should see if you can get a home loan of the R3 as well.
In for a penny, in for a pound...
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Nov 14, 2020 15:54:48 GMT
I think I know what the issue is. It's the glass ceiling in your listening room, giving horrendous reflections. Either that, or the thread title is very misleading. You should see if you can get a home loan of the R3 as well. In for a penny, in for a pound... I'll see how I get on with what I have on the way. If no joy, they'll be next on the list |
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Post by macca on Nov 15, 2020 10:16:49 GMT
Sunday, so it's Yamaha day!
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Post by Deleted on Nov 15, 2020 10:43:08 GMT
I'll make do with Yamazaki today.
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Post by macca on Nov 15, 2020 10:55:07 GMT
I had to look that up.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 15, 2020 12:46:48 GMT
Must be new speaker day, as he is quiet...
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Nov 15, 2020 13:16:20 GMT
Must be new speaker day, as he is quiet... Correct!  |
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Post by Bigman80 on Nov 15, 2020 13:18:47 GMT
These are a superb listen Better than I recall them being and they are sat on the floor lol Didn't we have a member who used to make stands for these? karma67 |
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