Bigman80
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The HiFi Bear/Audioaddicts/Bigbottle Owner
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Post by Bigman80 on Jun 4, 2020 21:12:50 GMT
Really glad you've found the RF culprit!
I'm hoping the MultiFET boards are here soonish, as at the minute i am waiting on 100 BF861B to arrive so i can match them.....oh what fun!!
Looking forward to hearing what you think when they land on your doorstep
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 23, 2020 10:40:42 GMT
Improvements:
Having an enforced lull between jobs, I've decided to move my build to two boxes. A phonostage one would hope could be a compact affair, certainly in solid state that is the case. With valves and the size of the power supply in this case, there is little option but to use a full sized case (which I don't have room for) or go to two cases making it quite a bulky build, but does the effort and cost add up to a worthwhile endeavour or should you stick to a compact single box economical solution? I was so far down the road with this one that the only thing to do was to see it through properly so I invite you to join me in the final journey here: I selected a matching height and style of case for the power supply and the following pictures show the build progression. My thanks to Alan and Oli once again for their support, for being patient with me after I fried one of the JET boards and sorting out replacements, much appreciated, and really for the encouragement to see it through. Box assembled (on left) and transformer and wiring thrown in to start the "what, where, how?" process:
Power switch removed from main circuit case and that hole will later be masked when I receive my batch of RFC product badges from the factory. 6 pin DIN fitted to rear of main case: Main circuit enclosure re-wired for din connections...almost as fiddly as the JFETS! The DIN connector I selected also was more like a Krypton factor puzzle to assemble and ones previously used but much better quality.
Power supply enclosure drilled for fittings and all wired up: Temporary red LED installed within main enclosure. In this case I drilled a 6mm hole, chamfered, for a 5mm LED. The final (blue) one will use a heat resistant blob of clear silicon to set it in place. I have taken the power feed from the soft start/stop power circuit board supply which is already at 7.3 volts approx. To chose the correct LED and circuit it's a simple case of using the following formulae: Series resistor value to use between power source positive rail and LED anode (or cathode) is: R = (Vr-Vf)/power rating of LED (required) which must be less than Iw Where Vr = supply voltage, Vf = forward voltage of LED and Iw = forward current of LED. In my case I will be using LEDs with a 5mm body, 3.2V forward voltage and Iw of 20mW. This though would be too bright so I will use half this value as a starting point, so my resistor needs to be: (7.3-3.2)/(0.010) = 410 Ohms. I have some 330R and 1K resistors so I'll start with the 330, doubled to 660 then try the 1K and pick the one that gives adequate brightness without running too bright.
Sound:Having wired and connected everything up, the acid test was in the listening. Bearing in mind I've now fitted a closely matched pair of Teles for the PCC88's and a Tungsol 803s for the V2 position, the valves now ought to be sorted as none of these proved microphonic at all. A 20 minute warm up and settling time and then straight into playing some LPs. I wasn't expecting a night and day improvement over the previous iteration, perhaps just a little quieter but I was surprised to find that it WAS what I can honestly describe as a night and day uplift. The combination of the right (and matched) valves ensuring equal channel balance and hopefully adhering to correct RIAA balance, also happened to be much quieter with no discernible heater noise or any noise at all with volume turned up higher than I'd ever listen to. Any semblance of transformer hum was gone...entirely gone. In fact before anything could be heard through the speakers at all, the volume was over 3/4 of the way round the dial where max safe listening levels are less than half way, so with vinyl, this would prove to be utterly silent in background noise so a big tick in the box. Onto listening: Biggest changes here were in detail and channel separation. Yes, new output coupling caps were in place as well as the valve changes and the FET boards installed. Without knowing if the changes were a collective upgrade or down to one specific change I don't know as I don't have access to the circuit diagram to see how it's all interconnected, but what I can say is wow...that soundstage now goes from one wall to the other, way beyond the speakers. Because I use time aligned and phase correct speakers, the depth of the recorded space comes through with astonishing presence and clarity on live recordings, not multi-tracked close mic'd stuff. So was it all worth it? Well, yes but with reservations. Part of me still says, (the head speaking) that it should be entirely possible to have a compact phonostage at less cost than commercial offerings because the circuit can easily be compactly packaged, this takes up a lot of real estate and there's no getting over that. the heart, however says that it has been a resounding success based purely on the end result. Whether its the euphonics of valves I am liking more than the flatness of many solid state offerings, I don't know. All I know is that this offers what many do not, an emotional connection with the music and where live recordings are concerned, in a system capable of revealing it, a real sense of presence. That to most of us I'd bet sums up what we want from our systems, surely? Top marks to Oli for project managing to the degree that he has and with the enthusiasm that he has, and in particular to listening to feedback and acting on it. The last point has turned a modest design that does what it says on the tin into one frankly a cut above the rest, where "the rest" is perhaps many that exist out there to £2.5K in valve land. There are lots that run it close or beat it but few can be had under £2K. I would advise under that mark looking at one of the Trilogy phonostages for SS offerings or where valves are concerned, this one and only one other that I can honestly recommend... This is where things get interesting as that "one other" in entry level valve offerings is the TRON Convergence but here I lay may cards on the table for honesty. Oli and Alan are not aware of this, so it should come as a pleasant surprise just how close the BB3 is: Mine isn't a standard TRON Convergence, but a special order one from Graham called the "TRON Signature" which is a much rarer beast and the only one currently that I know of in existence and a very much upgraded and re-worked Convergence. The TRON has a different presentation to the BB3 but is still a fair comparison. This is not, nor should it become a "shoot off" of one V's the other because that would be largely non constructive, subjective and miss the points I'm trying to make here so lets not get too distracted by that side of things. I am only throwing it in because I use two TT's and one uses the TRON. It has, if anything, in Signature trim, even more detail and a pretty amazing depth of sound stage, but isn't perhaps quite as wide as the BB3. My original TRON Convergence to my ears was a little light on one channel in bass which initially was why it was sent back, and it was found that one of the valves was out of spec which had adversely affected RIAA below 1KHz by around 2dB which is significant. This was corrected and measured with new, matched valves but the whole thing was taken apart and converted with just about all components changed to shoe-horn in the "Signature" version. It now has very accurate RIAA (tested) but I cannot give away what in the circuit was changed, but safe to say it is most definitely up there with the best in this price group and what I like about it is it's neatly packaged into a compact enclosure too. The BB3 is still well worth the effort because you can achieve stunning levels of performance, to my mind way better than the EAR 834 or even the latest Icon Audio PS2 as well as the PS3 Mk2, and that, ladies and gentlemen, is quite an achievement so well done Oli and Alan. It's really quite an extraordinary stage. It is still possible to package it into a compact case IF a toroid is used but for the best sound quality, a traditional E&I to my mind is the better route as long as you can get it far enough distant or well enough shielded from the PCB. For quietness it matches the TRON, no mean feat! For those already started along the DIY route, I would most humbly present a case for going the whole hog on this build to get the potential from it. The difference between not doing so and actually investing the time and money and effort in doing so is quite staggering in terms of sound quality uplift. I hope that this has been an honest and fair description of my own "BB3 journey" but please take it as it is intended, just an honest opinion. Once more my congratulations to Oli and Alan, and to all you reading this who want the best valve stage in this price category, you do owe it to yourself to speak with Oli, and in fact to Graham, as each offer something pretty unique but undoubtedly very special and neither really can be bettered in terms of valve power unless you are prepared to spend an awful lot more. There's a big jump to the next best valve stages and that means upping budgets to between £2.5K and £5K or more. Below those levels I have not tried anything that really competes with either of these two. As a final comment, I will throw in that I am happy for anyone to visit me and listen to either of these stage for themselves especially where it might be a little too far to visit either Oli or Graham. I stand to gain nothing from this, nor should I, but I operate an ethos of supporting UK small businesses so am happy to do my part, as one of those businesses because I passionately believe that the best hifi has "gone underground" in the Uk and you simply will not find these little gems on the shelves of major company outlets. I will add some better photos once I have badging and LEDs finally sorted.
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Post by jimbo on Jul 23, 2020 11:27:14 GMT
Sounds like an interesting and very satisfying conclusion to your BB3 build Paul. I have yet to hear the BB in the Mk3 version but no doubt that will happen hopefully soon.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 23, 2020 11:54:14 GMT
Thanks Jim. Yes, very worthwhile and the Mk3"i" (for improved!) I think may become the "Mk4" before long as it seems to have evolved a bit,but the beauty is all Mk3's are easily done the way Oli and I have done ours and it's not really worth skimping if you want the best from the Mk3, yet it still allows those on tight budgets to make a one box build that works well.
As it happens, I have a dedicated R core transformer in it's original box, new and unused which I will offer posted to anyone who wants it for £29
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Post by firebottle on Jul 23, 2020 11:59:25 GMT
Now that's an interesting revelation Paul, that your Convergence is an 'improved' version.
Very good and honest write up, very very happy that you have got there with the build and the performance.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 23, 2020 17:16:00 GMT
Now that's an interesting revelation Paul, that your Convergence is an 'improved' version. Very good and honest write up, very very happy that you have got there with the build and the performance. LoL! yes, I had to be honest about that Alan. I've been quite happy to fly the flag for Graham since first hearing his Convergence design (which with proper valve matching should be ruler flat, as mine now is) but his Signature version is quite heavily reworked so you're welcome to have a listen and see what you think. I think you'd be quite impressed by it.
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Jul 23, 2020 21:58:01 GMT
Well well well, a sneaky little Tron Convergence Signature ay! Only £2.5k worth of phonostage up against the beast that is the BB3 lol.....
Fantastic writeup and yes, i echo Alan, glad you saw it through to the end.
As for a one box build.....nah. why compromise on noise etc for the sake of €35 for another case from Modushop! Lol
Seriously, this phonostage is worth the investment and I have been saying this for a fair old while now. The potential was clearly there and it was just a case of digging in and pushing through the last few yards.
Thanks for taking the time to share this experience and a HUGE thanks for offering a listen at your place for those too far from me...I really appreciate that.
Now, just sort that BB logo out and I'll rest easy haha,
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bigbird
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Post by bigbird on Jul 24, 2020 7:05:37 GMT
Nice thorough write up matey and congrats on getting it over the finish line. It’s been nice to follow other people’s different builds from the shadows whilst mine was being built, and see the slightly different configurations.
As everybody else has said , this phono is now very very capable of mixing it with some of the big boys.
I had the newest version of the Whest 2.2 with improved discreet stage, which many say is the best sub £2k phono in the world and all I can say is that the BB3 is on the next level up. The Whest is slightly smoother and cleaner (Possibly as it’s SS) but the BB3 is deeper, wider, more detailed and airy And you really hear the production and engineering on the records ,and how they are layered and stuctured as opposed to just hearing the music.
The great thing is , I still think you have a bit more to squeeze from it if you go for the Clarity Cap CMR’s .
Oliver and Alan were so impressed with the increase in soundstage with mine that they both bought a set instantly.
I think this phono would now mix it in the 3-4K region if all of the small things like ultra matching components , and using top quality parts elsewhere are followed. It’s an absolute Hifi bargain . Well done on a collective efffort lads . Great stuff
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Post by jimbo on Jul 24, 2020 11:18:49 GMT
Which MC cartridge have you been using Karl? I suspect that the BB3 will deliver stellar performance with most MC cartridges or at least bring out the best of their ability.
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Jul 24, 2020 11:49:19 GMT
Which MC cartridge have you been using Karl? I suspect that the BB3 will deliver stellar performance with most MC cartridges or at least bring out the best of their ability. AT-ART9 Not a bad little runner!
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Post by Deleted on Jul 24, 2020 12:22:58 GMT
Nice thorough write up matey and congrats on getting it over the finish line. It’s been nice to follow other people’s different builds from the shadows whilst mine was being built, and see the slightly different configurations. As everybody else has said , this phono is now very very capable of mixing it with some of the big boys. I had the newest version of the Whest 2.2 with improved discreet stage, which many say is the best sub £2k phono in the world and all I can say is that the BB3 is on the next level up. The Whest is slightly smoother and cleaner (Possibly as it’s SS) but the BB3 is deeper, wider, more detailed and airy And you really hear the production and engineering on the records ,and how they are layered and stuctured as opposed to just hearing the music. The great thing is , I still think you have a bit more to squeeze from it if you go for the Clarity Cap CMR’s . Oliver and Alan were so impressed with the increase in soundstage with mine that they both bought a set instantly. I think this phono would now mix it in the 3-4K region if all of the small things like ultra matching components , and using top quality parts elsewhere are followed. It’s an absolute Hifi bargain . Well done on a collective efffort lads . Great stuff That's exactly what I also heard. I'm not at all sure whether output coupling caps are responsible as without knowing the circuit it's impossible to speculate but I can tell you that with the CSA caps, it sounds identical to Oli's stage which does use CMRs. I think that the JFET tweaks and the use of the pair matched and balanced Telefunkens plus the Tungsol 803s possibly made the greater difference with mine. Irrespective, it does forensically strip the recording to the extent that you can clearly hear, on live recordings, the acoustic cues from the recorded space including reverb, depth and spatial cues. You couldn't before the JFETS were fitted and when I was using different valves. The real big improvement seems to be in noise floor. It is exceptionally good for a valve stage which are notoriously hard to get much above 85dBA S/N when boosting such low voltage signals. The ZYX MC cart sounds superb now, both using the Convergence "S" and the BB3. There's clearly a whole gulf of difference between a decent MC and even some of the better MMs when you have this sort of resolution so it highlights just how important the phonostage is. In fact, I don't honestly think that I could recommend any MC cartridge to anyone again unless and until their phonostage is up to scratch. A good MM set up is probably far better VFM, if not sound-wise than an entry level MC played via an entry level MC stage. The reports now from just about everyone taking care with their builds and going the whole hog pin-point very similar outcomes sound-wise, so whilst (ultimately) these things are very system dependant, the commonality is that even higher investment more revealing systems are able to benefit from the sound quality this offers and that makes it a bargain. Perhaps if doing this again I'd use two smaller cases, both a similar size to my power supply case (but without the cooling fins which in my case are not needed, it just happened to be a case that fitted the bill).
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bigbird
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Post by bigbird on Jul 24, 2020 20:20:08 GMT
Sounds like an interesting and very satisfying conclusion to your BB3 build Paul. I have yet to hear the BB in the Mk3 version but no doubt that will happen hopefully soon. Hi Jim. Yeah as Oli said , it’s the AT Art 9. It’s a fantastic cartridge for the money. I’m yet to hear anything sub 1500 that can show it a clean set of heels. I genuinely believe it’s underpriced. Iv had an Ortofon Rondo bronze with FG80 tip, Ortofon 2m bronze, a Soundsmith, Regas top MM offering , and the ART has blown them all away in my setup . When she finally dies I shall likely move up the ladder I think, but to be fair it’s real high end sound for real world money .
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bigbird
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Post by bigbird on Jul 24, 2020 20:31:38 GMT
Nice thorough write up matey and congrats on getting it over the finish line. It’s been nice to follow other people’s different builds from the shadows whilst mine was being built, and see the slightly different configurations. As everybody else has said , this phono is now very very capable of mixing it with some of the big boys. I had the newest version of the Whest 2.2 with improved discreet stage, which many say is the best sub £2k phono in the world and all I can say is that the BB3 is on the next level up. The Whest is slightly smoother and cleaner (Possibly as it’s SS) but the BB3 is deeper, wider, more detailed and airy And you really hear the production and engineering on the records ,and how they are layered and stuctured as opposed to just hearing the music. The great thing is , I still think you have a bit more to squeeze from it if you go for the Clarity Cap CMR’s . Oliver and Alan were so impressed with the increase in soundstage with mine that they both bought a set instantly. I think this phono would now mix it in the 3-4K region if all of the small things like ultra matching components , and using top quality parts elsewhere are followed. It’s an absolute Hifi bargain . Well done on a collective efffort lads . Great stuff That's exactly what I also heard. I'm not at all sure whether output coupling caps are responsible as without knowing the circuit it's impossible to speculate but I can tell you that with the CSA caps, it sounds identical to Oli's stage which does use CMRs. I think that the JFET tweaks and the use of the pair matched and balanced Telefunkens plus the Tungsol 803s possibly made the greater difference with mine. Irrespective, it does forensically strip the recording to the extent that you can clearly hear, on live recordings, the acoustic cues from the recorded space including reverb, depth and spatial cues. You couldn't before the JFETS were fitted and when I was using different valves. The real big improvement seems to be in noise floor. It is exceptionally good for a valve stage which are notoriously hard to get much above 85dBA S/N when boosting such low voltage signals. The ZYX MC cart sounds superb now, both using the Convergence "S" and the BB3. There's clearly a whole gulf of difference between a decent MC and even some of the better MMs when you have this sort of resolution so it highlights just how important the phonostage is. In fact, I don't honestly think that I could recommend any MC cartridge to anyone again unless and until their phonostage is up to scratch. A good MM set up is probably far better VFM, if not sound-wise than an entry level MC played via an entry level MC stage. The reports now from just about everyone taking care with their builds and going the whole hog pin-point very similar outcomes sound-wise, so whilst (ultimately) these things are very system dependant, the commonality is that even higher investment more revealing systems are able to benefit from the sound quality this offers and that makes it a bargain. Perhaps if doing this again I'd use two smaller cases, both a similar size to my power supply case (but without the cooling fins which in my case are not needed, it just happened to be a case that fitted the bill). It’s hard to pinpoint exactly what brought about the improvements in sound between mine and Oli’s . Maybe it was the caps maybe not, I’m no engineer , far from it 😂, but, Oliver had my phonostage, built to exacting values as his across the board, he even used my trio of NOS telefunken valves . The only difference was that he had CSAs in his build and I had the CMRs in mine . He and Alan both reported improvements in soundstage and ultimately both bought the same caps which they still have in theirs now. Maybe they can add to their findings ? I have to agree with you with regards to MC playback. You do need to invest in a decent cart and phono to get the best from it. But when you do there is no going back IMO. Cheers and I hope you have many happy hours of listening
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Post by Deleted on Jul 24, 2020 20:35:09 GMT
That's exactly what I also heard. I'm not at all sure whether output coupling caps are responsible as without knowing the circuit it's impossible to speculate but I can tell you that with the CSA caps, it sounds identical to Oli's stage which does use CMRs. I think that the JFET tweaks and the use of the pair matched and balanced Telefunkens plus the Tungsol 803s possibly made the greater difference with mine. Irrespective, it does forensically strip the recording to the extent that you can clearly hear, on live recordings, the acoustic cues from the recorded space including reverb, depth and spatial cues. You couldn't before the JFETS were fitted and when I was using different valves. The real big improvement seems to be in noise floor. It is exceptionally good for a valve stage which are notoriously hard to get much above 85dBA S/N when boosting such low voltage signals. The ZYX MC cart sounds superb now, both using the Convergence "S" and the BB3. There's clearly a whole gulf of difference between a decent MC and even some of the better MMs when you have this sort of resolution so it highlights just how important the phonostage is. In fact, I don't honestly think that I could recommend any MC cartridge to anyone again unless and until their phonostage is up to scratch. A good MM set up is probably far better VFM, if not sound-wise than an entry level MC played via an entry level MC stage. The reports now from just about everyone taking care with their builds and going the whole hog pin-point very similar outcomes sound-wise, so whilst (ultimately) these things are very system dependant, the commonality is that even higher investment more revealing systems are able to benefit from the sound quality this offers and that makes it a bargain. Perhaps if doing this again I'd use two smaller cases, both a similar size to my power supply case (but without the cooling fins which in my case are not needed, it just happened to be a case that fitted the bill). It’s hard to pinpoint exactly what brought about the improvements in sound between mine and Oli’s . Maybe it was the caps maybe not, I’m no engineer , far from it 😂, but, Oliver had my phonostage, built to exacting values as his across the board, he even used my trio of NOS telefunken valves . The only difference was that he had CSAs in his build and I had the CMRs in mine . He and Alan both reported improvements in soundstage and ultimately both bought the same caps which they still have in theirs now. Maybe they can add to their findings ? I have to agree with you with regards to MC playback. You do need to invest in a decent cart and phono to get the best from it. But when you do there is no going back IMO. Cheers and I hope you have many happy hours of listening Try the new ZYX Ultimate 100....it redefines what's possible from an MC cart under £2K...utterly mindblowingly good. The only one I've heard which might better it was well north of £2K being from the Myajima stable.
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bigbird
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Post by bigbird on Jul 24, 2020 20:44:40 GMT
It’s hard to pinpoint exactly what brought about the improvements in sound between mine and Oli’s . Maybe it was the caps maybe not, I’m no engineer , far from it 😂, but, Oliver had my phonostage, built to exacting values as his across the board, he even used my trio of NOS telefunken valves . The only difference was that he had CSAs in his build and I had the CMRs in mine . He and Alan both reported improvements in soundstage and ultimately both bought the same caps which they still have in theirs now. Maybe they can add to their findings ? I have to agree with you with regards to MC playback. You do need to invest in a decent cart and phono to get the best from it. But when you do there is no going back IMO. Cheers and I hope you have many happy hours of listening Try the new ZYX Ultimate 100....it redefines what's possible from an MC cart under £2K...utterly mindblowingly good. The only one I've heard which might better it was well north of £2K being from the Myajima stable. Ok great , Thanks. I shall add that to the list of things to try out. I’ve always heard great things about the ZYX carts . I’ve not seen any about here in Melbourne but I am sure they will be out there somewhere. I heard a VDH Colibri not long ago and bloody hell that was another ball game all together .
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Post by Deleted on Jul 25, 2020 9:54:31 GMT
There's some uk retailers no longer stocking or selling vdh carts for some reason. One local to me near Bristol has pulled his stock and won't be supplying more. I've not heard the Colibri but any cart at that price had better be good! The ZYX 100 Ultimate retails at under £1500, so relatively speaking, for the performance on offer is something of a bargain as it replaced the whole previous generation of "100's" including the Yatra and Fuji models. I'm perfectly happy with the R50-Bloom LO, it's a stunning cart with a'stage capable of presenting what it can offer.
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Post by jimbo on Jul 25, 2020 14:09:48 GMT
Sounds like an interesting and very satisfying conclusion to your BB3 build Paul. I have yet to hear the BB in the Mk3 version but no doubt that will happen hopefully soon. Hi Jim. Yeah as Oli said , it’s the AT Art 9. It’s a fantastic cartridge for the money. I’m yet to hear anything sub 1500 that can show it a clean set of heels. I genuinely believe it’s underpriced. Iv had an Ortofon Rondo bronze with FG80 tip, Ortofon 2m bronze, a Soundsmith, Regas top MM offering , and the ART has blown them all away in my setup . When she finally dies I shall likely move up the ladder I think, but to be fair it’s real high end sound for real world money . It will be on the list of MC cartridges to explore in future, I believe Oli has also heard this cartridge and thought it rather good. Knowing what AT cartridges are capable of it will be a definite consideration.
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Jul 25, 2020 23:45:08 GMT
Hi Jim. Yeah as Oli said , it’s the AT Art 9. It’s a fantastic cartridge for the money. I’m yet to hear anything sub 1500 that can show it a clean set of heels. I genuinely believe it’s underpriced. Iv had an Ortofon Rondo bronze with FG80 tip, Ortofon 2m bronze, a Soundsmith, Regas top MM offering , and the ART has blown them all away in my setup . When she finally dies I shall likely move up the ladder I think, but to be fair it’s real high end sound for real world money . It will be on the list of MC cartridges to explore in future, I believe Oli has also heard this cartridge and thought it rather good. Knowing what AT cartridges are capable of it will be a definite consideration. I had a AT-ART7 here Jim, Very good, but a bit rich, tonally for me. Lived on the warmer side of playback but super smooth and enjoyable.
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Post by karma67 on Jul 26, 2020 7:09:32 GMT
i have heard both,i owned a art-7 (from angus)before going with the orto kb, in between i briefly had an art-9,it sounded more alive than the 7 but that could be down to old stylus vs new,it went back after a week due to mis-aligned cantilever and that kinda put me off AT cartridges.
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Jul 26, 2020 8:13:09 GMT
i have heard both,i owned a art-7 (from angus)before going with the orto kb, in between i briefly had an art-9,it sounded more alive than the 7 but that could be down to old stylus vs new,it went back after a week due to mis-aligned cantilever and that kinda put me off AT cartridges. I would try an ART9...i like AT's pricing v performance and yes, getting a squewed cantilever is undesirable, I am sure they would sort a refund, replacement etc.
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Post by karma67 on Jul 26, 2020 9:04:19 GMT
i have heard both,i owned a art-7 (from angus)before going with the orto kb, in between i briefly had an art-9,it sounded more alive than the 7 but that could be down to old stylus vs new,it went back after a week due to mis-aligned cantilever and that kinda put me off AT cartridges. I would try an ART9...i like AT's pricing v performance and yes, getting a squewed cantilever is undesirable, I am sure they would sort a refund, replacement etc. yep,they did with no hassle.i like the extra tweaking for azimuth though that you get with the kb and other similarly bodied ortofons.
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Bigman80
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The HiFi Bear/Audioaddicts/Bigbottle Owner
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Post by Bigman80 on Jul 26, 2020 9:05:29 GMT
I would try an ART9...i like AT's pricing v performance and yes, getting a squewed cantilever is undesirable, I am sure they would sort a refund, replacement etc. yep,they did with no hassle.i like the extra tweaking for azimuth though that you get with the kb and other similarly bodied ortofons. Yes, Ortofons are pretty awesome....thinking I need one myself to be honest.
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Post by jimbo on Jul 26, 2020 10:48:12 GMT
Ortofon Kb always seem available and another back on the MC list. I suspect after living with a 2M Black for so long however the AT cartridges might suit me better? Although there are also lots of leftfield choices......Lyra, Dynavector or maybe this...?
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Jul 26, 2020 11:55:42 GMT
Ortofon Kb always seem available and another back on the MC list. I suspect after living with a 2M Black for so long however the AT cartridges might suit me better? Although there are also lots of leftfield choices......Lyra, Dynavector or maybe this...?
That looks interesting Jim, whats the cost?
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Post by Deleted on Jul 26, 2020 15:30:11 GMT
£1269 at Analogue Seduction....
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Bigman80
Grandmaster
The HiFi Bear/Audioaddicts/Bigbottle Owner
Posts: 16,401
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Post by Bigman80 on Jul 26, 2020 15:59:56 GMT
£1269 at Analogue Seduction.... WOW!
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Post by jimbo on Jul 27, 2020 8:19:16 GMT
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