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Post by jimbo on Mar 27, 2020 18:12:07 GMT
Hans Beekhuyzen gives his opinion on wired or unwired digital streaming.
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Bigman80
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AA Founding Member & Bigbottle Audio Creator
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Post by Bigman80 on Mar 27, 2020 18:43:30 GMT
I'm getting the best sound using the Wifi to control Volumio via the app on my phone.
I know that's probably not the way most would go, but it's working here
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Post by sq225917 on Mar 27, 2020 19:33:21 GMT
Any differences will be down to how well the dac is shielded from the wifi and the quality of the buffer/reclocker.
Thetes no difference on mine between local ssd controlled via wifi and a full wifi airplay implementation.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 28, 2020 19:37:41 GMT
As has been mentioned this question depends on the streaming source and the wifi. Personally I've always used a wired connection if at all possible but I've never realy done any serious testing and I have to say the Chromecast Audio is an excellent wireless streaming device and in my home almost never suffers from any drop outs. I've just purchased a DAP that has both an excellent Bluetooth chip and Airplay 2 but I've yet to try either and use it hard wired when I'm using it in either of my systems so when I've got some time I'll try them both out.
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Post by pauld on Mar 28, 2020 23:10:15 GMT
Wired every time and I have found the cable you use can even make a small difference too.
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Post by sq225917 on Mar 29, 2020 0:35:51 GMT
I user a wireless controller but my ssd is under my pi and even the controller does the last 5m over network cable
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Post by macca on Mar 29, 2020 8:37:54 GMT
Good ole Hans. He sounds like he knows what he's talking about, he has that oscilloscope in the background so it looks like he knows what he's talking about. Just 50 seconds in and he's talking bollocks.
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Mar 29, 2020 9:27:27 GMT
Good ole Hans. He sounds like he knows what he's talking about, he has that oscilloscope in the background so it looks like he knows what he's talking about. Just 50 seconds in and he's talking bollocks. Oh Macca, why don't you like Hans! I love him....I dont listen to him tbf, but dont listen to most people. I enjoy his videos though. |
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Post by macca on Mar 29, 2020 10:01:06 GMT
I've nothing against him personally. There seems to be dozens of people now with these You-tube hi-fi channels talking crap, and most of them are really bad at talking crap. Whereas Hans is really good at making it sound all so believable. Credit were it's due.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 29, 2020 11:43:37 GMT
The bit about your neighbours taking your bandwidth amuses me.
I can’t receive my neighbours WiFi signals. They are all too far away.
However, with the Mrs constantly streaming TV to her iPad, wired every time for me. This means I can set the router to prioritise my music above her telly, as she does not know any different. When the little one is also watching TV over the Internet, I often don’t have enough bandwidth with the main internet connection to stream Tidal HiFi.
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Post by macca on Mar 29, 2020 12:42:04 GMT
''You need the samples coming in at regular intervals otherwise the sound quality may deteriorate due to buffers working overtime.''
'Buffers working overtime'. What does that even mean? They are not getting time and a half so they are not doing a proper job? Either it will play the music or it will drop out, it won't 'deteriorate'. Note he does not say how this 'deterioration' might manifest itself in audible terms. This is aimed squarely at those suffering from audio nervosa.
''A 1000 euro switch on a 500 euro stereo is giving very low return on investment, if any. For a twenty K costing stereo it does give a very high rate of return.''
Classic get out - ''can't hear what I'm talking about? That's because your systems not expensive enough'' If the problem he discusses was real you'd hear it on pretty much anything.
a network engineer takes Hans to school. Hans deletes replies like this to his videos rather than attempt to rebut them. Why is that?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 29, 2020 12:49:30 GMT
For audio data streaming via router wired absolutely all the way, for playback via an on board SSD the wifi control is more than acceptable.
Do I buy into expensive re-clocked network switches,you can look for alternatives which are more than equal imho
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Mar 29, 2020 13:09:09 GMT
''You need the samples coming in at regular intervals otherwise the sound quality may deteriorate due to buffers working overtime.'' 'Buffers working overtime'. What does that even mean? They are not getting time and a half so they are not doing a proper job? Either it will play the music or it will drop out, it won't 'deteriorate'. Note he does not say how this 'deterioration' might manifest itself in audible terms. This is aimed squarely at those suffering from audio nervosa. ''A 1000 euro switch on a 500 euro stereo is giving very low return on investment, if any. For a twenty K costing stereo it does give a very high rate of return.'' Classic get out - ''can't hear what I'm talking about? That's because your systems not expensive enough'' If the problem he discusses was real you'd hear it on pretty much anything. a network engineer takes Hans to school. Hans deletes replies like this to his videos rather than attempt to rebut them. Why is that? - Interesting indeed, however he does have a point that if your system isn't capable, you won't always hear the same amount of differences as someone else reports. Note i don't say "more expensive" Also, i am pretty sure this Hans Vs Network guy video, at times boils down to the age old "this doesnt make any difference" vs " actually it does" Whilst the engineer makes some great points, if Hans hears a difference, then he hears a difference. I think he may not know how to explain it and thus has opened himself up to a technical good hiding. I don't need one of these devices or i'd happily do a real world experiment with it. |
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Post by macca on Mar 29, 2020 13:18:43 GMT
Maybe Hans does hear a difference but if so he needs to confirm that there really is a difference before going on the internet telling it how it is. It isn't like preferring one amplifier to another. He's claiming things are happening that shouldn't be possible. That requires some proper testing, done blind, and with care taken to eliminate all other variables. That last part is very important if jumping to incorrect conclusions about what is occurring is to be avoided.
Just amazes me that people think they can determine what is happening in a technical sense just by listening.
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Post by sq225917 on Mar 29, 2020 14:45:44 GMT
I'd take a reclocker an inch from my dac running a dac clock multiples rather than one in a switch at a nominal data transfer speed multiple every day of the week.
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Mar 29, 2020 14:56:27 GMT
Maybe Hans does hear a difference but if so he needs to confirm that there really is a difference before going on the internet telling it how it is. It isn't like preferring one amplifier to another. He's claiming things are happening that shouldn't be possible. That requires some proper testing, done blind, and with care taken to eliminate all other variables. That last part is very important if jumping to incorrect conclusions about what is occurring is to be avoided.
Just amazes me that people think they can determine what is happening in a technical sense just by listening. That's a good point. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 15, 2020 18:46:24 GMT
Definitely wired to me. That way only maximum of the quality can be squeezed out of the source. Such is my personal experience anyway. Others might have different view on that subject however. Not every one is looking for the best performance ratio and many valuates convenience above everything else.  Just few pennies |
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Post by sq225917 on Jun 15, 2020 20:14:02 GMT
The thing with buffers is, they either run empty and the music stops, or they dont thetes no hal measures.
I have no preference for wired vs wifi assuming the wifi is solid
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Bigman80
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Post by Bigman80 on Jun 15, 2020 20:42:09 GMT
The thing with buffers is, they either run empty and the music stops, or they dont thetes no hal measures. I have no preference for wired vs wifi assuming the wifi is solid I did try both and liked wired but I would not have put money on knowing if it was wired or not. |
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Post by covenant on Jun 16, 2020 15:19:07 GMT
In my case wired to powerline plugs.I know that they are detested in the hifi world but they work fine for me. I bought the best ones I could get at the time and they have been totally reliable with no crosstalk of hum issues. Getting rid of the router that Talktalk provided and getting a decent Netgear one sorted buffering problems.
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Just few pennies 